From: "Gary Britt" 

Dyana, I haven't been anything except objective with you.  I thought we had
a perfectly good/friendly exchange needed no apology from either one of us,
nor was such an apology offered by either of us.

I was confused by your original statement and you ended my confusion with a
clarification.  As much as John would like it to be otherwise, that's all
that was said by either or us.  I was perfectly happy with our exchange,
and was under the impression you were as well.

Oregon's death with dignity law is too new to have meaningful statistics on
its use and abuse.  It doesn't however contain many of the protections and
avoidances of conflicts of interest in the insurance/medical industrial
complex that I feel are needed to avoid doctors beginning to kill people
against their wishes or without their expressed  consent as is the
documented results of a similar practice in the Netherlands.

The Netherlands government itself has documented over 1000 cases per year
of patients being killed/put to sleep by doctors against or without the
consent of the patient.  This does not include the number of patients who
were talked/pressured into killing themselves by doctors and relatives or
the number killed/put to sleep by surviving relatives wishes only.  The
study also noted a statistical anomaly that there was a statistically
significant higher percentage of patients WITH MONEY being killed/put to
sleep by relatives than those being put to sleep/killed by relatives when
the patient didn't have any money.

Gary

"Dyana"  wrote in message
news:43daf8b5{at}w3.nls.net...
>
> > Did your husband know he was about to be put to sleep?  The paragraph
above
> > makes it sound like he didn't?
>
> Hence, my clarification post.
> >
> > There are significant problems with doctors being in the death business.
> > Not the least of which is when its legal to kill patients upon their
request
> > that doctors and others begin killing people AGAINST their wishes.  The
> > Netherlands, where killing patient's by doctors is legal, has done a
study
> > of their system and found over 1,000 patients KILLED WITHOUT THEIR
CONSENT.
> >
> > There are other problems with doctors being in the death business.
HMO's
> > and other managed care health insurance programs pressure doctors and
> > hospitals through rules and bonus systems to kill/allow patients to die
even
> > when that may not be the patient's or family's wishes.  The doctors and
> > nurses and hospital care liaisons begin pressuring family members when
they
> > are at highly emotional states to sign non-resuscitation orders and
other
> > releases that allow the patients to die/be killed much more quickly.
This
> > process which is bad enough at the time of last illness would become
much
> > worse where doctors are allowed to legally kill patients.
> >
> > I understand the awful circumstances which can make some patients and
some
> > family members of dying patients wish for a more quick end to what
appears
> > to be the inevitable.  Should that ever become legal, doctors performing
> > patient care should NOT be those illegally empowered to kill patients,
any
> > all possible, direct and indirect, profit motives from the patient's
death
> > (whether by cost reductions in treatment and care expenses or through
the
> > selling of patient organs and/or services related thereto (e.g. profit
from
> > their transplant, etc.) must be completely eliminated beyond any
question.
> > Further, the killing of these patients should NOT be legal in the care
> > facilities.  It should take place only in a death facility that the
patient
> > is transferred to.  Without these kinds of safeguards those wonderful
> > compassionate doctors you write about will start killing patients
against
> > their will.  Then they and their hospitals breakup the champagne and
> > celebrate the positive effects on their bonuses from the
insurance/managed
> > care industry.
> >
> > Gary
>
> My reply was to the Oregon law. Not active euthanasia. Oregon's law
> gives the
> individual the right to take or NOT take the medication. Many have never
> filled
> the prescriptions written.
>
> You might wish to view Oregon's own statistics on the use of the DWDA
> (Death with Dignity Act).
>   The PDF can be downloaded here:
>
> http://egov.oregon.gov/DHS/ph/pas/docs/year7.pdf
>
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>
> I accept the apology given later by you in this thread.. and I share
> your wish that you and your wife
> have such a heartfelt goodbye.
>
>
> Should you care to be objective toward me I suggest you read the
following.
> Sorted in chronological format.
>
>
> http://lchelp.org/community/viewtopic.php?t=16720
>
> http://lchelp.org/community/viewtopic.php?t=17528
>
> http://lchelp.org/community/viewtopic.php?t=17673
>
> http://lchelp.org/community/viewtopic.php?t=17856
>
> http://lchelp.org/community/viewtopic.php?t=17887
>
> http://lchelp.org/community/viewtopic.php?t=19108
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Dyana

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