Hi ROss,

On Thu 2038-Feb-04 20:48, Ross Cassell (1:123/456) wrote to Richard Webb:

 RW> I note that as well, and HOpe DAn's alright.  I was thinking at first
 RW> he was a part of the glitch in the northwest. I haven't really paid
 RW> attention, except maybe to note that the echolist was keeping echomail
 RW> conferences listed.  Other than making sure that it acknowledged my
 RW> netmails keeping my echos updated I pay little attention to the
 RW> echolist, it's acted sorta flaky, as in the robot has here of late a
 RW> few times .

RC> Doesnt help matters when the echolist keeper accidentily sets his
RC> system clock one year ahead..:-)

  Yah saw that when I got back from hanging out
with my lady at the hospital.

 RC>> There is no rule for handling echomail suspensions, as far as how
 RC>> they are issued.

 RW> That's right, never has been.  There have been attempts to
 RW> promulgate some and have them accepted, but that hasn't
 RW> happened.


RC> and never will..

Right, but, I let folks know in the echomail conference I'm
responsible for what they can expect, right up front.  I
also note that I'll correspond via netmail, and if the sysop doesn't allow
users netmail, well that's between him and his users.  I'd hope a sysop
that receives nm for a user
apprising them of posts that are deemed not appropriate for
one of my echoes would have the courtesy to his user of at
least letting them see that nm.  I try to make echo rules
which are easily enough complied with.

RC> Here is the rub, Wayne doesnt have access to netmail on the board he
RC> uses at least via QWK.

True, note that from other users of that system I've wanted
to communicate with other than in the echo.

RC> But I dont make it a habit to netmail people whom are not in the
RC> nodelist. 

Two sides to that one.  I don't want the echo to be burdened with traffic
about a rules violation.  I might mention it
once in the open echo, then no further.

 RC>> Wayne wont respond to you if it means him issuing a mea culpa, too
 RC>> many times do we see users inventing rules for a network they are
 RC>> a guest of.

 RW> Wouldn't know about your first point,

RC> I think this point is bearing itself out..
I"ll wait and see what happens there.  I asked him what is
imho a legitimate question however.  I'm not trying to point fingers, just
point out some facts, which, now that the
discussion has gone further elsewhere makes it moot whether
he answers me or not.



RC> Yeah, I am a user of the Internet, I am going to make up a rule and
RC> accuse everyone of breaking it.. LOL

Yah we see this on usenet all the time.  EVen understood
conventions for usenet are poorly understood these days
though.  I.e. unless it says binaries in the group name
chances are it's plain text only, etc.

 RW> Anybody reading here can pick up back issues of the fidonews and look
 RW> at the various attempts to formulate echomail policies, and in many
 RW> cases the various documents themselves right in the snooze.  None were
 RW> given force of authority.

RC> There are elements of "echopol" in place that the Euro's use, but I
RC> remember the thermo-nuclear explosions going on in the sysop echoes
RC> when they tried to pass it here. Speaking of users citing rules,
RC> another user, Lee Lofaso, also tries to rabidly quote echopol by
RC> saying it applies over here, har!

YEp, I've read all the articles, and was still lurking
around the edges at the time.  ONe board I accessed gave me
read-only access to the sysop echoes after I was no longer
nodelisted, as a friendship thing.  even as a point he gave
me access, violation of policy I know, but knew I"d never
post there as I wasn't nodelisted at the time.  HOwever, he
was polling ld for his fidonet traffic, and I subsidized his phone bill
quite a bit .

RC> I have 10 years experience as a regional coordinator and major mail
RC> mover, I know the rules and procedures, despite Waynes incorrect
RC> perceptions. 

I saw both sides of that when the echopol wars first
started.  I as a sysop wanted to be treated fairly.  I also
wanted my users treated fairly.  This meant that if an echo
moderator advised me of a problem user of my system I was
quick to take action.  that also meant that I monitored
what/where my users were posting.  I taught users of my
system how to use the email gateway at 1:1/31 back in the
day, and was quick to cut a jerk off at the knees if he
abused it.  YEt I was also understanding with the newbies
and helped them learn the ropes.  IN those days this whole
computer communications thing was a new world to many of my
users, so it took a bit of hand holding at times.  HEnce I
understood some of the positions of all sides in the echopol debate.  Where
they lost me was when they started the
advocacy of "cooling off periods" and such foolishness.  If
you must as a mail feed, cut the feed to the offender, then
adjudicate.  That's when they lost me and lost my future
support.


Regards,
           Richard
...      Vegetarian is an old Indian word meaning "bad hunter."
--- timEd 1.10.y2k+