cv wrote:
> On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 04:44:06 -0800, bluesmama wrote:
>
> >
> > cv wrote:
> >> On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 15:52:59 -0800, bluesmama wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> > cv wrote:
> >> >> On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 11:51:29 -0800, bluesmama wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >> > cv wrote:
> >> >> >> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 16:49:35 -0800, bluesmama wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > cv wrote:
> >> >> >> >> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 09:01:37
-0800, bluesmama wrote:
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> > Hardpan wrote:
> >> >> >> >> >> THE RULES
> >> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> > This is undoubtedly one of
the saddest things I've ever
> > read.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> I take it that you haven't heard
of the bestseller "The
> > Rules"
> >> > by
> >> >> >> > Ellen
> >> >> >> >> Fein, Sherrie Schneider? This book
set the ball rolling
by
> >> >> > promising
> >> >> >> > to
> >> >> >> >> teach women the power-play needed
to snag a man. Or were
you
> >> > less
> >> >> >> > saddened
> >> >> >> >> by that?
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> Besides, women's magazines are
overflowing with tricks to
> > hook
> >> >> > guys,
> >> >> >> > are
> >> >> >> >> you saddened by that too?
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> > Life is
> >> >> >> >> > short, and uncertain, and
there's no guarantee that
> > there's
> >> >> >> > anything
> >> >> >> >> > beyond this life -- so to
spend precious time on such
> >> > bitterness
> >> >> > is
> >> >> >> >> > such a terrible waste of time
and energy.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> Check out alt.seduction.fast or
www.fastseduction.com.
These
> >> > guys
> >> >> > are
> >> >> >> >> busy refining their
"rules" and are delighted with the
> > results.
> >> >> > They
> >> >> >> > are
> >> >> >> >> not bitter in the least. This
stuff works very well,
> >> > apparently,
> >> >> >> > which is
> >> >> >> >> quite a commentary on the modern
western woman.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> Weren't you of the opinion that
women were not
responsible
> > for
> >> >> > taking
> >> >> >> >> advantage of men's chivalry? Isn't
it ironic that a
person
> > such
> >> > as
> >> >> >> > you
> >> >> >> >> should feel sad on reading a few
"rules"?
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> -CV
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > Whether it's bitterness by women aimed
at men, at other
women
> > or
> >> > at
> >> >> >> > themselves - or bitterness by men
aimed at women, at other
> > men
> >> > or
> >> >> > at
> >> >> >> > themselves -- it's always sad.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> But these guys are hardly bitter, if
anything they are
relieved
> >> > and
> >> >> >> excited. Whatever bitterness they do
exhibit is limited to
> > their
> >> > past
> >> >> >> experiences as nice-guys who were taken advantage of.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Besides, women's magazines are dripping
with "relationship
> >> > advice",
> >> >> > would
> >> >> >> you also describe them as dripping with
bitterness? That
would
> >> > make a
> >> >> >> large population of western women bitter with men.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> I think you have this whole bitterness thing wrong.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> -CV
> >> >> >
> >> >> > You seem to have a problem with an assertion
central to most
of
> > my
> >> >> > posts, that men and women are both capable of
the best and
the
> >> > worst.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > These guys either are or aren't bitter - your first two
> > sentences
> >> > seem
> >> >> > to contradict each other, because they can't be
both. They
may
> >> >> > certainly be bitter in addition to other things, such as
> > relieved
> >> > and
> >> >> > excited (at the thought of all those cowed
women they'll soon
be
> >> >> > bedding)
> >> >>
> >> >> Parenthetically, women excel at emotional cowing. Men, as a
group,
> >> > can't
> >> >> hold a candle to women, as a group, in this regard.
> >> >>
> >> >> -CV
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > I'll agree there, but ask you - do you think women excel at
> > emotional
> >> > forms of control because that's what works, and also because
they
> > can't
> >> > compete (mostly) with how men can use physical forms of control?
> >>
> >> This was true in the past, men can't use physical force anymore.
> >
> > Men can and do use physical force to control (and physically strong
> > women can and do as well) but it's just not as socially acceptable.
> > Emotional force used to control (most often used by women) just
needs
> > to be tamed by the same social controls.
> >
>
> Yet the only one's complaining about emotional force are women of the
> Domestic Violence industry. They have coined terms like "emotional
> violence" and "financial violence." These terms are, of
course, only
> applied against men. Goes to show that feminists are a special
interest
> group, they have no genuine interest in equality.
>
Sounds like you're complaining about emotional force, and applying it
solely to women. How is that different?

Shelters do both good and harm; I've worked in one and seen things I'd
rather not have seen, both from men and from women. One of the many
reasons why I'm firmly convinced neither sex has a lock on vice or
virtue.

I believe that shelters are started with good intentions. But what
sociologist said that the first unstated goal of every organization was
to support itself and expand....will have to look it up unless anyone
knows the source offhand and can enlighten me.



--- UseNet To RIME Gateway {at} 3/22/05 12:00:08 PM ---