Hi Bob,

> Ward Dossche wrote to mark lewis on Monday May 31 2004 at 10:59:

>> Are you referring to the verbal assault of one Janis Kracht via the
>> back-channel on probably the most sympathetic and popular RC in
>> zone-2, Sean Rima, and got him so de-motivated/discouraged/disgusted
>> that he withdraw from Fidonet in order to be safe from her abusing
>> him?

> As I've written before, Sean has other problems that have nothing to do with
> fido.

That would seem to be true.. That day we exchanged perhaps 6+ messaes in
ICQ before he disconnected from all file echos and msg. echos here..when I
asked him why he'd done that, he said he'd asked me not to talk about it,
or involve him, or some such and so he was leaving fidonet.. the only
reason I brought it up to him at all was because I was so shocked by Ward's
announcement in Fidonews. I really thought Ward [and Sean] had a better
handle on what could and couldn't be changed P4-wise.. and that Ward had
attempted to change the voting structure of the ZCC after he'd been
replaced.

> You aren't the only one who dealt with him. And if he and Janis had a
> set-to, that's too bad but is something that occasionally happens in fido. I
>also regret his loss to fido, but there were definitely other components than
> mere dispute with Janis involved.

I do regret the whole incident as well.. even if it was this one discussion
that led to him leaving, I have to figure that if he felt pressure, it was
because two of his 'friends' were at odds, and he felt he must side with
one of them.  Then again, perhaps he did feel that strongly that Ward
should remain IC.. And if he did(does) feel that way, I have to wonder
why.. Like I said, we only exanged about 6 msgs. in ICQ that day..

>Anyway, how would leaving fido "protect" anyone from
"abuse" sent via email or
> ICQ or whatever else you're referring to?

True..

> I know this is one of the reasons you've got a mad on for Janis, just like
> she's got a mad on for you because of your one-sided stance on political
> developments in the States and your questionable overruling of the Z1 *Cs on
> the van der Vlist complaint.

I've said it a number of times and yet sometimes you seem to hold on to
this idea that there's some connection between the van der Vlist descion
and my proposal in ZCC that we should vote for a new IC.. :)   I do have a
serious
disagreement with Ward's interpretation of some parts of policy4.  As
others have noted, nowhere does it say that each node in Fidonet must agree
to accept crash netmail from any other node, thereby giving up the right to
control how one's own system is used. What P4 says is that nodes must be
available to
'accept mail' during ZMH. It doesn't state what the 'flavor' of that mail must
be (crash, direct, routed, etc.). This is how things have been understood
in Zone 1 since I first joined Fidonet.

> But if the "old" Ward Dossche isn't completely dead yet, you
might start
> thinking a bit more about fido and a bit less about your own personal
>aversions, and come back down to earth again. You'd make more people than only
> me happy by doing that.

True.. you know, I really did count Ward as a friend. When you said
somewhere that we are too much alike, I laughed .  The big
difference that I see is that I would never twist policy 4 to accomplish
some ridiculous goal.

Take care,
Janis

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