*** Quoting Nancy Backus from a message to CAROL SHENKENBERGER ***

 CS> So did you match that with age of mother for first birth and the
 CS> *equal* in  1968?  Or did you just spot a stat that matches what you
 CS> want to think?  Did  you match maternal death with child death or
 CS> ignore it as if the mother was  irrelevant?

 CS> Think Dan, think.
NB>  
NB> As I told him, stats can be used to prove just about anything...

NB> And I don't think he's really listening to any of us...

Seems not . While cesaerians my be a bit overused, they are
overall saving ¨lives. Mother mortality rates are *way* down as opposed to
say 1900.

 DC>> And, infant mortality for cesaerians is twice as great than that for
 DC>> a natural childbirths.  
 CS>> Butnot caused by thge cesearians.  The child's status more often
 CS>> determines that than the mother's.  IE:  High risk babies almost
 CS>> always delivered that way. 
 CS>> Statstics have to be looked at closely before they mean anything.
 DC> The fact is, infant mortality rates for cesaerian births.  

 CS> The fact is high risk babies die at a far higher rate and now, we save
 CS> more of  them than before due to cesarians.  We also have more 'high
 CS> risk ones' because  women are delaying that first child til they are 30
 CS> and over. xxcarol

NB> Exactly.  And also, more of the teenage-mother births are being
NB> classified as high-risk, as there are more and more of younger teens
NB> giving birth.  Babies that couldn't have made it in times past are at
NB> least given a chance now, with today's technology.  And sometimes that
NB> includes a caesarian.

Thats a somewhat historically recent thing though. Culturally we redefined
¨'whats too early' around mid-1800's.  Mother death rate for first
childbirth ¨went way down when we culturally decided '17 is better than
14'.  Infant ¨mortality wasnt that different I seem to recall, but the
mother lived to try ¨again.

Death in childbirth used to be very very common.  So common that by age 30,
men ¨well outnumbered women.  Stats show that when you reduce or almost
eliminate ¨that factor, women outnumber men all the way up the age group.

NB> "natural childbirth mortality statistics" have been moved
over to the
NB> other column, just because the c-section was tried in order to try to
NB> save the baby.

Yes.  Mother mortality goes down too.  But then again, natural childbirth'
¨sounds so good to guys who will never have to do it...  or die from it. 
¨Something every mother has faced front up, and personal.
                                       xxcarol

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