"Andre Lieven"  wrote in message
news:cshbg9$877$1{at}theodyn.ncf.ca...
>
> Mark Sobolewski (mark_sobolewski{at}yahoo.com) writes:
> > In article ,
> >  dg411{at}FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Andre Lieven) wrote:
> >
> >> "geopelia" (phildoran{at}xtra.co.nz) writes:
> >> > "Philip Lewis" 
wrote in message
> >> > news:351i95F4hci8lU1{at}individual.net...
> >> >>
http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/archive/c-e/c-e-misc/ellsworth011705.htm
> >> >>
> >> >> Yes, Ms. Dowd: Feminism Really Was A Cruel Hoax
> >> >>
> >> >> January 17, 2005
> >> >>
> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >> by Eva Ellsworth
> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >>  (snip)
> >> >
> >> >> Ms. Dowd asked, "So was the feminist movement a
cruel hoax?"  Yes,
it was.
> >> >> Not because, "The more women achieve, the less
desirable they are?"
but
> >> >> because feminism led some women to forego their true
desires to
pursue
> >> >> careers they did not particularly want.  My secret
ambition was to
be a
> >> >> 1950s style housewife.  I kept that dream in the
closet for many
years
> >> >> because the feminist movement made me feel it was
wrong to want
that.  I
> >> > did
> >> >> what I was supposed to do - college followed by career.  The
pressure to
> >> >> excel left little time for a social life.  When I was 27, I
experienced
> >> >> ovarian failure.  Not only will I never be able to
bear a child; I
will
> >> > also
> >> >> have a harder time finding a husband as a result. 
My message to
young
> >> > women
> >> >> is that one can go to college or find career success
at any age.
When it
> >> >> comes to having a family, it may be too late too soon.
> >> >>
> >> >> Eva Ellsworth
> >> >
> >> > What is really sad is the need today for both partners to work
outside the
> >> > home, just to pay off a mortgage and make ends meet.
> >>
> >> Indeed. As Mark Sobolowski has pointed out, this is due to women
flooding
> >> the labour market in the late 60s/early 70s, and thus *depressing*
wages.
> >>
> >> So, suck it up, ladies: YOU did that ! 
> >
> > Not only did they depress wages, but also increased consumption.
>
> Quite.
>
> > I find it incredily dishonest how commies try to argue that
> > evil Patriarchy causes pollution in the third world AND in
> > the same breath then condemns the USA with it's top earning
> > rates for women for being such pigs.  China and India are
> > increasing their need for oil and other resources.  Of course:
> > The women are using gas powered washing machines rather than
> > washing the clothes in the stream.
>
> Sure. Labour saving devices are mostly, in the home, aimed at
> women. From SUVs to washers and frost free fridges, all those
> need to be built, sold, transported, and provided with power.
>
> So, women are driving a *lot* of the demands for lifestyle that
> is at the root of increased pollution, as well as the added
> congestion on roads, and the added needed fuel for said vehicles.
>
> >> > One cannot "go to college
> >> > and find career success" if the weekly wage is
essential, and anyway
> >> > there is no money for college fees. The same goes for
having a child.
> >> > That has to be put off until "we can afford
it" when it may be too
late.
> >>
> >> Really ? Ask all those sprog whelping teens if they were deterred by
> >> that...
> >>
> >> > The really tragic problem is when an unplanned (yes, accidents can
> >> > happen even today) but much wanted child must be aborted because
> >> > there is just no other way. If the woman is well into
her thirties,
> >> > it may be the only child she is ever able to have.
> >>
> >> Boo, hoo, hoo. Thats called a *consequence*, ladies. Be women, suck it
> >> up !
> >>
> >> > We talk about the problems of teenage pregnancy, but
forget about the
> >> > married woman who just can't afford to have the child.
> >>
> >> And, Father Nature will ensure that such women's selfish DNA gets
weeded
> >> out of the gene pool. Thus, Feminism truely is a one way street to
> >> genetic irrelevence.
> >
> > Sadly, this applies to some women who are just victims of the situation:
> > Working class women who could give a rat's ass about feminism
> > but are not having too many kids they can't afford to have because
> > of the situation.
> >
> > Andre, let's not be like Parg and hate the opposite gender.
>
> Indeed not. But, with all the women-*only* means of avoiding becoming
> mothers, I cnanot find any pity for their *chosen state*.
>
> As I said, this is about choices having distinct consequences. Its
> disingenuous at best, outright lying at worst, for such women to
> make their choices, with their predictable consequences, and the
> to whine about it. When men had... no choices at all.
>
> " When you choose the behavior, you choose the consequences. "
> Dr. Phil. And, its not like hes on the guy's side...
>
> >> > And if a woman wants to be a 50s style housewife, (and
why shouldn't
> >> > she have that choice?) she must find a husband earning enough and
> >> > willing to support her and the children. That is not easy today.
> >>
> >> Indeed, *due to Feminist changes in divorce laws*.
> >>
> >> Thanks for showing that you don't believe that women should be
rsponsible
> >> for their mass actions and demands. How... Feminist of you.
> >>
> >> Ptui.
> >>
> >> Andre
> >
> > regards,
> > Mark Sobolewski
>
> Andre

Men have choices about contraception, just as women do. Where an abortion is
necessary, it should be discussed and agreed on by both partners. In the end
though, it has to be the woman's decision, as she must carry the child. I
feel sorry for men who cannot afford children, just as I do for women. I'm
even more sorry though for children who come into the world unwanted and
resented for "spoiling their parents' lives".

Geopelia
>
> --
> " I'm a man... But, I can change... If I have to... I guess. "
>                                     The Man Prayer, Red Green.



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