JPH>BN>And at that point there's no common frame of relative reference,
JPH>BN>so if we're talking about a supposedly common basic subject we then
JPH>BN>end up talking at cross-purposes, which can't possibly work. ;)
JPH>        Why not? We're doing fine now!
JPH>        This whole idea that we *must* a common frame of reference
JPH>  misses the point of what I was posting.  If we need one, we can whip
JPH>  one up.  It doesn't have to be there all the time, and it can be
JPH>  temporary.  Secondly there is *nothing* in your frame of reference
JPH>  that I have to consider binding.
Would work for me -- otherwise I'd probably just have to shoot you.

JPH>BN>Nope, what I said was that some people take their _own_ version of
JPH>BN>Trek as the One True Trek over everyone else's -- somewhat large
JPH>BN>difference there. };)
JPH>        Not quite.  If some one, like the hypothetical Poster Pinky says
JPH> that his Trek is the One True Trek, then there's aboslutely *nothing*
JPH> he can do to make this so, so let him say as often as he wants.  You
JPH> keep missing this point.  Listen carefully.
Nope, I'd caught it, all right. ;)  It's just that if he holds that
as his personal FOR & then tries to use that to dictate to the
various realities held by other folks, conflict ensues.  What I said
& what you inferred I said I said are different.  My point is what
would result from his seeing his reality & being an ass about it,
as opposed to merely his seeing his reality - that's the difference:
the FOR combined with the attitude as opposed to simply the attitude
by itself. ;)
JPH> Pinky says "This is the one true Trek."  Then that doesn't matter.
JPH> There is nothing he can do to back this up.  Period.
Back it up, no, but scream & holler & therefore cause de facto
trouble on the echoes with the people who _don't_ ignore him, yes,
which IYR was my core point from the beginning. :)
JPH> We are free to ignore him.  I recommend this course.
If everyone could, conflict'd = 0, I quite agree.  But prima facie
everyone doesn't, & thus QED. }:)
JPH>        To say that there *must* be a frame of reference says that
JPH> Poster Pinky = Wrong and that Bill Nichols = Right.  This is more or
JPH> less exactly what Poster Pinky just screamed about himself.  Your one
JPH> true Trek isn't any better than his because there is no one true trek.
JPH>        Now you say that this isn't what you're saying.  Technically
JPH> true, but when you say that Poster Pinky is *wrong* then that implies
Nope, never said that, nor even implied it.  PP was your creation,
not mine; I wasn't even talking to him, remember? }};)
JPH> that there must be a *right* out there somewhere. Then you use
JPH> as a way to define it.
I did??  When did this happen & why wasn't I told?! 
I did in fact say that the basics in everyone's Trek must coincide
or else there'd be conflict about it, but that's about all I said.
};)
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