Jonathan Michaels @ 3:712/808 wrote on 01-17-98 13:59 about *2b *&%^$@$&##& 
????*
 JM> i hope you and your kind live long enoough to find out what it is
 JM> like to have this kind of a life.
Howdy Jonathan (smile)........not trying to tread on your toes here but all 
people have problems of one kind or another.......true some more serious than 
others.  Myself, I've had arthritus for a number of years now besides other 
medical problems developing as I got older (47 years old now) and I know that 
I'm one of the lucky ones as there are others who would give their right arm 
in trade to only have my aches and pains to contend with instead of the ones 
they are currently inflicted with.  One of the nice things about Fidonet, in 
my honest opinion, is that for the most part people try and help one another 
in whatever way they can but sometimes, mainly due to the medium involved, a 
persons intentions get misinterpreted as being flakey or antagonistic in 
nature.  Maybe this is the case here?  
 JM>> anyway .. that is one of the real reasons why fidonet forbids
 JM>> the use of hi ascii in echomail and netmail ...
 LB>> Fidonet does not forbid the use of "hi ascii" in echomail or in
 LB>> netmail. 
 JM> when i get to a complete set of ftsc archives i will quote
 JM> chapter and verse at you .. ftsc does explicitly prohibit the use
 JM> of characters outside the range as is traditionally know as the
 JM> basic ibm printable character character set. because this was the
 JM> standard for all printing terminals be they 'vdu' screens or the
 JM> more ubiquitious printing keyboards of the day .. we are talking
 JM> about the 1970s here, if, if that is, you can rememnber back that
 JM> far. 
While this once was true at one time, Fidonet Policy 4 (at least the copy I 
have and I am not aware of any update to this version) dosn't mention 
anything at all about the non-use of certain characters in Fidonet.  Present 
protocols on character acceptance in the various echos seems to have been 
left up to the discression of each area moderator(s).........some will allow 
them, some won't.
 JM> youin particular is quite simple .. which ftsc document recinds
 JM> the earlier one that issued toe edict concerning the "high ascii'
 JM> character's and how pray tell will they get around the issues
 JM> involved in the inevitable non ibm architecture specific
 JM> platforms that use these selfsame characters as operating system
 JM> meta characters ... put another way, since when did fidonet
 JM> become the sole provedance of the the ibm 8080 based hardware -
 JM> architecture and microsoft disk operating system, platform ?
It hasn't ever been and is still not........but, software development has 
come a long way since the 1970's;  this fact has to be taken into 
consideration Jonathan.  Just as computer software and hardware has evolved 
over the years, so to, in certain areas, has Fidonet.  Part of this 
progression in software, particulary in respect to software used by disabled 
people, is the modification of older code so that it doesn't barf on some of 
the more "weird" characters..........are there serious reports concerning 
newer software still acting up or is it perhaps a case of using out-dated 
software that's causing the problems?
 JM> i've assisted severapo programmer in the production of software
 JM> that helps people with the range of disabilities that i have
Are you saying that software problems in this area can't be overcome then?  I 
was under the impression that any ascii character limitation had been 
overcome but maybe I have been mis-informed in this area.
 JM>  to become better able to use the limited hardware, software and
 JM> that rubbish microsoft calls its operating systems packages and
 JM> its os shell as well.
Hmmm........well there are other operating system platforms available 
Jonathan, ones like linux are free, come with source code and are available 
for multiple hardware platforms.
 JM>  i am aware of the the state of play, which is far more than i
 JM> can say for your somewhat meager level of awarenes of this basic
 JM> of subgects ... how disabled people use computers.
Question for you..........if someone approached you and complained that they 
couldn't access the internet along with all of it's fancy graphics, frames, 
audio etc because they were running an 8088,  Vic 20, Apple 2 plus or some 
other older peice of computer equipment, how would you respond?
 JM> take some time to read what i've written, don't knee jerk as you
 JM> most probably will, take some time and comprehend .. 
As I mentioned before, Jonathan, I'm certainly not trying to tread on anyones 
toes here, but not affecting a "knee jerk" reaction is pretty much a two way 
street, right. (smile)
 JM> you just might learn someting about yourself and how others
 JM> percieve your own disability.
One of which is realizing that not everyone is a linguistic and/or writing 
expert.......again this is a two way street issue here Jonathan.  
Stereotyping people, especially in this medium, can be a big hinderance in 
the process of meaningful conversation or problem solving.  And you can be 
pretty well assured that if one corespondant presents an attitude, then 
messages full of other "attitudes" are shortly forthcoming.   In the end, 
there indeed may be justification for displaying such an attitude towards 
certain individuals (and I am sure you, like me have run across some of these 
"individuals" one time or another) but an opinion can't really be formed 
before clarification of debated issues have been initiated on a reasonable 
level by the parties involved.
Anyways just my two cents worth.........take care guy and will ttyl. :-)
--- Sqed/32 1.14/r15155
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