The-Trainers wrote:
> 
> On Mon, 31 Jul 2000, Bob Crownfield wrote:
> 
> > The NRA includes presidents, physicists, mathmeticians, aviators,
> > pilots, mariners, licensed captains, police officers, actors, actresses,
> > businessmen and women, housewives, and many more occupations.
> 
> And electronics engineers like myself, not to mention that I am a
> life-long Liberal Democrat who is exceedingly embarrassed by the
> bigoted gun-haters who have taken over my party.
> 
> At least the religious fanatics in the Republican party have ZERO
> chance of getting what they want, but my Democrats are now being
> run by some extremeists who want to force everyone to be 100% dependant
> on the government for EVERYTHING, especially defense from criminals,
> which CANNOT work, but IF Gore is elected, they will demolish our
> ability to exercise our rights.
> 
> > remember that many of the freedoms you now enjoy are granted and
> > reserved for you in the bill of rights.
> 
> NO! Sorry, but rights CANNOT be "granted", they can ONLY be protected
> or suppressed, but NOT "granted".

Recognized.

> 
> Our gun-rights are unalienable and self-evident and are endowed on us
> by our being alive and capable of exercising a CHOICE.
> 
> Rights CANNOT be "granted" ONLY priviliges can.
> 
> > It was written precisely for that purpose.
> 
> NO! It was written to REMIND future generations of the most vital rights
> we MUST ALWAYS PROTECT.

If there were no bill of rights, 
then you would have no legal basis to claim them as rights. 
If there were no second amendment, 
then there would be no right to carry and bear arms.

The Bill of Rights was added to the Constitution 
to recognize and enumerate those rights 
that all citizens are guaranteed under the Constitution.

The Constitution was very well written, and is a living document,
one that needs no interpretation for the times.

the one change I would suggest is that it specify that
'All Persons are created equal in fact and before the law'.

That the interpretation be simple:
no more men, women, gays, heteros, bi's: Just ALL are equal.


If it is a crime to do something wrong to any person, 
then it is a crime to do that same wrong to any other person.

> 
> > The only way to take them away is to change the constitution.
> 
> NO! Our rights are not "taken away", they are being suppressed every day
> and it does NOT require a change in the COnstitution in order to VIOLATE
> the Constitution, it happens every day and is getting WORSE!

1- Any law which contradicts any enumerated Right in the Bill of Rights 
   is UnConstitutional, and is unlawfull.

2- Any part of the Constitution can be changed by the amendment process, 
   but by no other method. there are two ways to amend the Constitution,
   and they are defined in the Constitution.


Bill Clinton will go down as the president 
who tried to subvert the Constitution.

> 
> > City, state, and federal laws may not take away those
> > rights, like free speach, freedom of religion, women's right to vote,
> > without amending the constitution.
> 
> They can't take away actual rights even then. Rights NEVER depend on a
> piece of paper to exist. At BEST paper can remind the future generations
> to protect a right, at WORST paper can help suppress a right.

but a right has to be recognized and defined to have any legal basis.
simply stating that a right exists ( you make up the example)
is a moral concept, but has no legal basis. 
If you add another amendment, then you can confirm it as a right.

> 
> > that also applies to the right to carry and bear arms. If that right can
> > be taken away, then the others can also.
> 
> Any rights can be suppressed, IF WE THE PEOPLE FAIL to stand up and
> protect our rights.

True, but not properly, and not legally, 
if the right is enumerated in the Constitution and Bill of Rights,
and the Constitution is not amended.

> 
> > "Protect freedoms before they become extinct."
> 
> Words to live by!
> 
> MY new .sig
> 
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> 
> Mike Trainer
> Life-long Liberal Democrat, gun-owner since the 1994 gun-ban,
> VOTER since Carter in 1976, NRA member since Al Gore 51-50 in 1999,
> Now voting ONLY on the issue of protecting my right to keep and bear
> arms 2000.

-- 
Bob Crownfield,  Crownfield@Home.com
Photography, Flying, Delphi Rad Addict
Now diving the Pacific in the LA Area.
"Protect freedoms before they become extinct."