Matrika - The wind whispered your name to me...
 
 
 Ma> re - I don't think it's of overwhelming importance to Him (HER ? - 
 Ma> GRIN) whether or not we believe in a trinitarian three-in-one God,
 Ma> etc. - (hope I quoted that right).  Well I'd have to agree personally
 Ma> with  all of what you said personally; however, we'd probably be better
 Ma> off  discussing that on the Interfaith echo, where I think you'd find
 Ma> the  vast majority of "regulars" would agree with you completely.  I
 Ma> have a  feeling it's a bit off topic here.
 
 I don't think it is off topic..religion can play a very big part in one's
 soberity..remember the purpose of this echo is rather like the before and
 after of the meetings...friends gathering over the coffee pot to talk 
 about things that they need to talk about, one on one...(or in our case
 here, one on whoever happens to read the message)..and, remember, you are
 a friend of the moderator...
 Ma> However, what I meant was not that my particular Church is the problem
 Ma> with my sobriety, but that my own religiosity - as opposed to 
 Ma> spirituality - can be a problem.  I have a tendency to get all caught 
 Ma> up in disputes over such doctrines and miss the point entirely -  the 
 Ma> point being what you've said so beautifully.  That a lot of this stuff
 Ma> really doesn't matter to my life.  It doesn't matter whether God is 
 Ma> male or female or both or neither or, in some inexplicable way, all of
 Ma> the above, in my daily routine.   IT doesn't matter whether God is, as
 Ma> you said, a trinity, three beings working together, one being or many 
 Ma> beings or a totally impersonally force, not in my day to day existence
 Ma> and in my search for sobriety, serenity and recovery.  NOW I AM
 Ma> TALKING FOR MYSELF ALONE HERE - lest someone take offense.  But I can
 Ma> get  caught up in this stuff and become very unhappy - as well as to
 Ma> busy to work on my recovery.  In short, I would have to honestly say I
 Ma> can use  religion as another addiction when I want to and let it be
 Ma> something to hide behind so I do not face the real issues of my
 Ma> recovery, so that I  can stay sick.
 
 And so this becomes a part of recovery, in many ways..for good or not..
 Remember, if you can...KISS...Keep it simple, silly...
 Ma> I like what an oldtimer in Maryland AA used to say: "THe only thing I 
 Ma> need to know about my Higher Power is that I ain't it."   He'd say
 Ma> this at least once a month of so at our step meeting and it used to bug
 Ma> me,  but now I am grateful for it.
 
 Simple saying with much truth in it..
 Ma> My Church does frustrate me with it's local politics and personalities
 Ma> sometimes, true.  But I also have to look at the fact that sometimes 
 Ma> other members don't get drawn into all the contreversy and melodrama 
 Ma> the way I do.  Why is that?
 
 Perhaps because you need a "cause"...or because it is a part of your
 personality..to get involved...
 Ma> In Al-Anon one of the slogans is How Important Is It?  and that's a 
 Ma> slogan I really need, but still don't use well.
 Ma> .
 Ma> By the way, as a teen, I hung out at a Baptist Church because of their
 Ma> youth program, although I was not a member - know what you mean 
 Ma> precisely.
 Ma> .
 Ma> As for Phil, I'm glad you hooked up with him - I had to made a 
 Ma> mega-ammend to him after posting that to you, as I realized I broke
 Ma> his anonymity.  Fortunately I'm forgiven.  (OOOOOOPS - I don't usually
 Ma> do  that.)  But I think you'll enjoy the e-mail listing.
 Sweetie, you are as human as anyone else in the world..we do make mistakes
 but, at least, you have the courage to admit it and to try to make amends.
 You, to me, are a mensh...
 Light, Love and Laughter
 Marie - Starwitch
... Nothing ever becomes real till it is experienced. (Keats)
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
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