To Rod

I wish to thank you for a sensible response to my message
and i will just answer and explain myself and then i hope to leave the
subject behind me


 > Ron T Lewis is one of the biggest wankers this echo has ever seen, 
 > and
 > I certainly hope that you don't put all the participants of this 
 > echo
 > in the same class as him.

no i do not, unfortunately i got into a racial debate with him and he chose
to use the word "abbo", i got my back up about it, the subject
was barred in oz abled and he said that aust avtec was interested in it and
dared me to come here.


 > I don't consider myself a racist - although there are some races of
 > people that I wouldn't go out of my way to be "friends" with.
 > Sadly, the aborigine people happen to be at the top of this list.
 > Don't get me wrong here - Over the years I have met and been friends
 > with several abo's - both full blood and half blood.  However, it is
 > also only the aborigines that have ever hassled me for no reason at
 > all. Because of this minority (I assume) I have a natural 'dislike'
 > for the race as a whole. I acknowledge that this is unfair of me, 
 > and
 > I treat most abo's I meet these days with a fair degree of caution
 > until they show themselves to be friendly.  In contrast, I tend to

i do not consider myself a racist either, I think this may be a fair
description of the dislike that whites display for aboriginals, which is a
shame in a way because there (like any other race) have good and bad
aspects.
This degree of caution is the norm i think for many whites, i find that
approach is the one that my children and grandchildren have experienced.


 > I'm sorry you feel that way, because it isn't the words or names 
 > that
 > matter, it is the intent of which they are used which is important.
 > For example, in Australia, we think nothing of calling people
 > "bastards" ....  sometimes this is a term of endearment (he's a nice
 > old bastard), and other times its an obvious insult (Fuck off you
 > bastard).  It isn't the word, but how it is used.

yes i am aware that it is how they are used, I am not a politically correct
person but i am aware that words can hurt, the only experience we have had
with the word abo is the violence that follows it. I hate to see children
have to start off so young having to deal with the level of violence dished
out in school yards and telling me they call them abo.


 > I assume you are referring to the shooting of last year, that is
 > currently in the news?   The bastard that shot them should be shot
 > themselves. From what I have gleaned from the news in recent days 
 > this
 > really is/was nothing more than a violent act of racism, but it 
 > isn't
 > just the racism that offends me - The shootee should pay the same
 > price regardless whether it was Asian, white or black that he shot.
 > What *offends* me about this particular crime is the way the 
 > "racist"
 > aspect is being played upon...  it is the shooting itself that is 
 > the
 > real issue.  Sadly, this person could get a lesser sentence than
 > normal because it is seen as a racist issue.  :-(

I have witnessed violence because of words used for years and the word abo
is at the top of the list.
I agree the fact that it was a shooting the punishment should fit the crime
but people should be aware that words are usually the spark for violence
and 
it is the extreme violence that i am concerned with.
I know my grandson experiences extreme violence  (for children) and i find
that sad, he associates the fact he has been hit with being called an abo.
I know that children can be cruel but aboriginal children have to contend
with being outnumbered by gangs in school, sad and unfair for my grandson.


 > and "Italian".  As before, it isn't the word itself that is 
 > offensive,
 > but how they are used.  Personally, I feel that "abo" would be a 
 > less
 > offensive word than the others, simply because it is derived from 
 > the
 > full (and correct) word "Aborigine".   Abo is simply far easier to
 > say.

i would agree with you except i know the violence that it usually sparks
and i think it is embedded in aboriginals since school yard experience.  I
knew my own children hated that word at school and i watched them turn from
happy kind carefree children into very tough and extremely good at
fighting.  Now i watch with sadness as my grandson thinks that the only
reason he goes to school is to fight.


 > The thing here though is that kids themselves have no concept of
 > racism - kids are just naturally cruel.  How did your kids come to
 > understand that being called "abo" is a "bad"
thing, but being 
 > called
 > "aborigine" isn't?    Would it make any difference if your grandson
 > was being ganged up on and called "aborigine" rather than
"abo"? I
 > don't think so.

because he has never been hit and kicked when someone calls him aboriginal
but the word abo he associates with being set upon by a gang never only one
to one.
My daughter and stepson had the same experience as do all the relations as children.
I know children are cruel but not everyone has to go to school and deal
with teasing and certainly  not physical violence but every aboriginal
child will experience it, in predominately white schools.


 > I went to school with a white fella that had a bright red birthmark
 > covering almost half his face - We called him "checker board" (among
 > other things). His nationality and what we called him was totally

i am aware that children will get this teasing if they are in anyway different
but was this boy ganged up on and hit and kicked.


 >DL> grandson that even the Grade 7's won't take him on. Yes he has
 >DL> received a good education at school he has learnt physical violence
 >DL> and to call white people, dogs.
 >                                ^^^^^
 > And where did he learn this term?  At school or at home?

that is the sad part, none of the children that have ever lived in my home
learnt anything that they were to be proud of their black heritage and
their white heritage.
We are mixed family, I am white but i have lived in the aboriginal
community for over 35 years, I am treated with the greatest of respect.
I have many friends of both races but my family is predominately aboriginal
and in my home we do not make distinctions about colour, they learn it
outside the home and then come back to me (their white grandmother) and
question me as to why they call them abo and hit them.
It makes me sad because i see them full of potential and then have them
have to go out and deal with preconceived ideas about aboriginals and learn
to distrust whites at an early age.

ps i am sure that someone will pick up on the mistake i made in the first
sentence it should have read, none of the children that have ever lived in
my home learnt anything other than that they were to be proud etc.......


 > This is the problem...  it isn't that you want us to be non-racist -
 > it is that you want us to treat abo's as *special*...  we can call 
 > an
 > Englishman a pom, but we can't call an aborigine an abo.
 > This is being hypocritical IMO.

no do you also gang up and hit the englishman because he is a pom.
this is my point about the word abo it is like the word nigger, in most
cases it is associated with violence, or it has been in my families
experience.


 > But that is all it is...  political correctness dictates that poms
 > should be called English, Ozzies should be called Australians, and
 > abos should be called aborigines...   That's not the way we speak
 > though...    and if we carry this PCness too far we won't even be
 > allowed to say "G'day" .. we'll all have to speak proper English and
 > say "Good morning" (or something).

my point about the word had nothing to do with political correctness it was
a point that the aboriginal people do not accept it as a shortened version
just as the word nigger is a shortened version of negro. It is deeper than
that political correctness crap it is associated with violence.


 > As for you though, well, I feel it is a shame that you entered this
 > echo proclaiming yourself to be aborigine, and I ask myself why you
 > did so.  Had you just entered here and carried on messaging 
 > *without*
 > telling us of your origins then we would never have known, and ALL 
 > of
 > us would have treated you as an individual and would have no
 > pre-conceived ideas about you.

that is a point, preconceived ideas, i entered the echo explaining i had
been invited by Ron T to discuss a racial debate and see how much backing
he would get as to him calling me an "ABBO".  Ron T was made
aware that i was white but he also had preconceived ideas that because i
mentioned my children and grandchildren were aboriginal, then i was also
aboriginal and that gave him the right to call me abbo and sling up about
aboriginals living in filth and that society viewed them as lazy black
trash.  YES and as he had anticipated i took offence because these are all
preconceived ideas because most of the aboriginals i know, live just like
white people, the good and the bad.

 > I feel that you are attempting to use your aborigine status as
 > "protection", because now when we disagree with you, you won't have 
 > to
 > take it personally, you will simply say/feel that it is BECAUSE you
 > are aboriginal, rather than because you said something absurd.
 > 
 > IMO, you are attempting to use discrimination to your advantage, 
 > which
 > is just as harmful as the discrimination you oppose.
 there is no status in our society as an aboriginall.


--- TMail v1.31.5