Bob Ackley -> Ed Hulett wrote:
 BA> Replying to a message of Ed Hulett to Bob Ackley:

 EH>> Bob Ackley -> Ed Hulett wrote:
 BA>>> Replying to a message of Ed Hulett to Bob Ackley:

 EH>>>>>>>> Besides, we aren't imposing our will on anyone.

 BA>>>>>>> We're not?  Our troops were *invited* in to
take over the country
 BA>>>>>>> and install a new government?

 EH>>>>>> Actually, they were invited, but George Bush
the Elder didn't
 EH>>>>>> accept the invitation. For that, Saddam
murdered hundreds of
 EH>>>>>> thousands of Shi'ites in the south and Curds in
the north.

 BA>>> Most of that was done prior to Gulf War I, Ed.

 EH>> Say what?!?

 EH>> You have things backward, Bob. It was *AFTER* Desert Storm that the
 EH>> Shi'ites revolted. The biggest attack against the Curds was in the
 EH>> late 80s, but we weren't invited to help the Shi'ites until after DS.

 BA> That's true.  But the gassing of Iranians and Iraqi citizens occurred
 BA> *before* Gulf War I.

I just said that.

 BA>>> In point of fact he got his poison gas from the US

 EH>> Total, unadulterated nonsense. The US has never given Iraq any
 EH>> chemical or biological weapons. EVER!

 BA> You might want to check your sources.

No, *YOU* might want to check *YOUR* sources. The US *NEVER* gave Iraq
"poison gas" of *ANY* kind.

The *ONLY* thing the US gave Iraq was agricultural research Anthrax. It was
not the type used for bio-weapons.

 BA>>> (for use against Iran's mass attacks on his troops
 BA>>> when those countries were at war - which Saddam was encouraged by the
 BA>>> US to start,

 EH>> No, you are making things up now.

 BA> Hardly.

Then you are just parroting nonsense made up by someone else.

 BA>>> BTW; whether or not he had a legitimate gripe against Iran I'm
 BA>>> not sure, but IIRC it was regarding access to the Persian Gulf);

 EH>> Iran tried to block Iraq's access to the Pursian Gulf.

 BA> So he did have a legitimate gripe, then.

Well, he also tried to expand his territory (take land from Iran) so they
retaliated and tried to block all access to him.

 BA>>> presumably the gas came from US Army stocks.

 EH>> That is a lie.

 BA> Absolute truth.

No, there is no way US Army stocks of "poison gas" (whatever you
mean by that) was given to Iraq. None. Notta. Nyet.

 BA>>>>> Invited by whom?  A bunch of antigovernment rebels?

 EH>>>> Would you prefer that Saddam had invited them?

 BA>>>>> That's the same thing
 BA>>>>> as saying the British were invited in to help the
South during the
 BA>>>>> US Civil War (which in fact they were, and which
fact precipitated
 BA>>>>> Lincoln's famous Emancipation Proclamation).

 EH>>>> Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!

 BA>>> Perfectly true, Ed.  Both points.  If you don't believe me check with
 BA>>> Vern Humphrey.

 EH>> I wasn't denying what you said. I was just laughing at how you made my
 EH>> point for me.

 EH>>>> Your point?

 BA>>>>> Somehow I don't think you'd've appreciated the
 BA>>>>> intervention of the Royal Navy to break Lincoln's blockade of
 BA>>>>> southern ports or the appearance of British Army
regulars in the
 BA>>>>> fighting.

 EH>>>> What on earth are you trying to say?

 BA>>> That you're not consistent.

 EH>> Hahahahahahahaha!!!!

 EH>> Give your strawman a rest.

 EH>>>> We were invited by the Shi'ites and Curds to help oust Saddam.

 BA>>> A bunch of antigovernment rebels.  Who, incidentally, were advised by
 BA>>> Bush41 to rebel against Saddam after Gulf War I, and of course
 BA>>> Bush41 then refused to provide them with any assistance after they
 BA>>> started out. Saddam's perfectly legitimate attempts to suppress that
 BA>>> rebellion, of course, led to Clinton's no-fly zones and ultimately
 BA>>> to the US conquest of his country.

 EH>> Oh yeah, it was legitimate for Saddam to mass murder men, women, and
 EH>> children (in some cases taking out entire villages) and bulldozing
 EH>> them into mass graves.

 EH>> The "no-fly zones" began before Clinton entered office.

 EH>>>> The
 EH>>>> Brits were invited by the south to fight against the federal
 EH>>>> government back during the "Civil War."

 EH>>>> Bush the Elder didn't accept the invitation,
unfortunately for the
 EH>>>> Iraqis. The Brits very prudently declined the invitation form the
 EH>>>> CSA, fortunately for the US.

 EH>>>>>>>> We are helping them rebuild their
country and government.

 BA>>>>>>> Most of which our troops - and/or ten years
of embargos - broke.

 EH>>>>>> Total, unadulterated nonsense. Saddam broke it
with his murderous
 EH>>>>>> sons' help.

 BA>>> Pure government propaganda.

 EH>> So those mass graves are all figments of someone's imagination?

 BA> Nope.  Many - not all - of the dead were war casualties.  I'm sure Iran
 BA> has several similar mass grave sites as they suffered even higher
 BA> casualties than did Iraq.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!

You really do need to change sources. Your sources are what is referred to
as loopy conspiracy theorists.

 BA>>> Note that I'm not claiming that any of the
 BA>>> three were nice people, nor am I denying that at least one of his
 BA>>> sons was a murderous psychopath.

 EH>> You've gone off the deep end, Bob. Saddam killed his first victim when
 EH>> he was only 12 years old. He killed his way into power. He used
 EH>> murder as a way of wielding his power. He was a terrorist.

 BA> He was also supported by the US government at the time.

No, he wasn't. The CIA was actively trying to get the pro-Soviet Iraqi
government out of power, but they stayed clear of Saddam as he was a loose
canon.

Ed

-- 
"Were the pictures which have been drawn by the political jealousy of
some among us faithful likenesses of the human character, the inference
would be, that there is not sufficient virture among men for
self-government; and that nothing less than the chains of despotism can
restrain them from destroying and devouring one another."

-- Alexander Hamilton and James Madison (Federalist No. 55,
15 February 1788)


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