Andrew Grillet (On 01 Jul 97) was overheard expounding to MARK PROBERT
 AG>MP>AG>JK> I also favor the return of corporal punishment in the school
 AG>MP>AG>AG>JK>system as
 MP>AG>So would I.
 AG>MP> Hmmm, so you favor assault on children. Totally unnecessary
 AG>MP> assault, I may add.
 AG> No. Corporal punishment means punishing the body -
 Precisely - physical punishment that if inflicted on an adult would
 constitute assault with battery.
 AG> and not necessarily participation in S&M.
 S&M on this side of the pond, in common usage/understanding refers to
 kinky sexual activities - does it mean something else there? (I have
 known some pretty sadistic "educators" so perhaps there is something
 there)
 AG> At my school we were made to run around carrying stones. Nobody
 AG> was ever beaten.
 Not corporal punishment as I understand the term nor as, I think, it
 is understood by most USAmericans.  I coach little league (baseball),
 after what _I_ consider to be a suitable period of instruction, boys
 who still insist on doing it _their_ way do pushups and run laps.
 This serves a dual purpose..I get their attention/cooperation and
 they receive a little extra conditioning.  Maybe not exactly the same
 thing, I don't have a "captive" group as in a school setting, they
 are free to stop participating....very few ever do.
 AG>MP> A less violent society would be an improvement. I see no
 AG>MP> direction in your post toward an improved society.
 AG> I would not consider slapping a kid on the back of the hand with three
 AG> fingers to be 'assaault',
 But it is... a physical punishment has been inflicted....and how many
 times do you think that it is going to be simply a 3 fingered slap
 on the hand before it escalates into a fist in the face or stomach..
 or more?
 AG> but I would consider locking a four year old in a room for even a
 AG> few minutes to be cruel. Others don't agree with me.
 You are referring to "time out".  I'll agree that "locking" any child
 into a room is not called for, however, sending a child to his/her
 room or a pre-designated spot where she/he has to stay quietly for X
 number of minutes (1 minute for each year of age is a fair rule of
 thumb) gives adult and child time to think before things degenerate
 into a physical confrontation.  IMNSHO far preferable to an immediate
 "smack" any place on the kid's body.
 AG> We have a major problem in our country with lack of discipline in
 AG> class.
 If the press and broadcast media is to be believed the same problem
 exists here.  I find it more than strange that little attention is
 given to the majority of students who excel ... doesn't sell
 newspapers or increase ratings ...
 AG> Can you suggest practical ways of improving the situation?
 I am not as familiar with the school system in the UK as I am with
 ours ... when I lived there I had no children so was not interested.
 Having said that I'll throw out a couple of my "pet" ideas....
 I do think that the education establishment needs to better police
 itself to weed out those obvious incompetents and, if they are
 incapable of doing so, an outside body should be created to do so.
 Classroom teachers should be given authority to, with good
 documentation, refuse admittance to their classroom those few who
 are continually disruptive to the learning process of others. Those
 disruptive students should be required to, without exception, attend
 alternative schools with higher levels of control built in.
 AG> Reading the Bible is NOT an acceptable answer, since the majority are
 AG> not Christians in this part of London.
 Reading the bible is an acceptable answer only to those who, through
 indoctrination, _believe_ it to contain the unfiltered words of their
 god and _believe_ they are commanded to _spread the word_.  On this
 side of the pond we are continually on guard against these sometimes
 well meaning but (IMO) misguided people.
 Public school is NOT the place for religious training for any flavor
 of religion.  There are thousands of churches, synagogues, mosques,
 temples etc etc that are in existence for that purpose.
 Damn!! Who dragged that soap box in here?????
... In Minnesota there is another word for Sushi....BAIT!
--- PPoint 2.03
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