From: "Rich" 

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   If you care about issues that don't involve the user as an active =
participant you need to avoid using these as examples.  In this thread =
you are replying to my reply to your example #2.  Your example #2 was = one
which involved a user.

   I'm not sure your concern is as clear cut as it might be with a =
corporate server.  You mentioned in another thread today that you had a =
problem with a collocated server for which your customer has =
responsibility or shares responsibility for the server and you can = suffer
from your customers mistakes.  This is not a technical issue and = there is
no technical solution.

Rich

  "Geo."  wrote in message =
news:3e34ac42$1{at}w3.nls.net...
  I still see user and system security as separate issues. I deal mostly =
with
  securing servers on the internet where users are customers so I don't =
have
  the option of training or patching the user. I only get to deal with =
the
  machines so perhaps this affects my pov.

  Geo.

  "Rich"  wrote in message news:3e348e6e{at}w3.nls.net...
     That is the root of many problems.  You can't get people to do =
things
  they should nor stop them from doing things that shouldn't.

     As for where things start, it has nothing to do with user or =
computer
  since the start, in the context in which you questioned it, would be =
with
  the sending of that email since that is the first step involving the =
person
  being attacked.  If you want to look from the perspective of the =
attacker
  then that could be any time prior and you get into the psychology of =
why
  someone chooses to be malicious.

  Rich

    "Geo."  wrote in message =
news:3e3486e7$1{at}w3.nls.net...
    "Rich"  wrote in message news:3e3438ec{at}w3.nls.net...

    >   In example #2, if someone sent to an email instructing you to go
  against
    your interest and open malicious web page, that would be the start =
as that
    is the first step that involves the person being attacked.<

    Yes but are you hacking the machine or the user? Trojans exploit the =
user
    not a component of the computer. You can't patch a user.

    Geo.



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   If you
care about issues =
that don't=20
involve the user as an active participant you need to avoid using these = as=20
examples.  In this thread you are replying to my reply to your = example=20
#2.  Your example #2 was one which involved a user.
 
   I'm not
sure your concern =
is as clear=20
cut as it might be with a corporate server.  You mentioned in = another=20
thread today that you had a problem with a collocated server for which = your=20
customer has responsibility or shares responsibility for the
server = and you=20
can suffer from your customers mistakes.  This is not a technical
= issue and=20
there is no technical solution.
 
Rich
 

  "Geo." <georger{at}nls.net>">mailto:georger{at}nls.net">georger{at}nls.net>
wrote=20
  in message news:3e34ac42$1{at}w3.nls.net...I=20
  still see user and system security as separate issues. I deal mostly=20
  withsecuring servers on the internet where users are customers so =
I don't=20
  havethe option of training or patching the user. I only get to =
deal with=20
  themachines so perhaps this affects my =
pov.Geo."Rich"=20
  <{at}> wrote in message news:3e348e6e{at}w3.nls.net...&nbs=
p; =20
  That is the root of many problems.  You can't get people to do=20
  thingsthey should nor stop them from doing things that=20
  shouldn't.   As for where things
start, it has =
nothing to do=20
  with user or computersince the start, in the context in which you=20
  questioned it, would be withthe sending of that email since that =
is the=20
  first step involving the personbeing attacked.  If you want =
to look=20
  from the perspective of the attackerthen that could be any time =
prior and=20
  you get into the psychology of whysomeone chooses to be=20
  malicious.Rich 
"Geo." <georger{at}nls.net>">mailto:georger{at}nls.net">georger{at}nls.net>
wrote in =
message news:3e3486e7$1{at}w3.nls.net...=
 =20
  "Rich" <{at}> wrote in message news:3e3438ec{at}w3.nls.net...=
 =20
  >   In example #2, if someone sent to an email =
instructing you to=20
  goagainst  your interest and open malicious
web page, =
that would=20
  be the start as that  is the first step that involves the =
person=20
  being attacked.<  Yes but are you
hacking the machine =
or the=20
  user? Trojans exploit the user  not a component of the =
computer. You=20
  can't patch a user.  =
Geo.

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