AWL> You can't be a Member of the White Pages, as you
AWL> get listed there by being a Customer of Telstra...

PE> I applied for a telephone number, and got listed in the white pages.

AWL> No Paul, you signed up as a customer of Telstra and paid
AWL> for a connection. They then assigned you a telephone number.

RS> Which is saying precisely the same thing as far as the list is concerned.

AWL> No it isn't.

Fraid so. An even better example would be a free fax directory which
you could just ask to be included in. In that case asking to have your
number included exposes you to no legal liability for what others who
also ask to have their fax number included on that list might do. And
its almost identical to Fido too in the sense that there is a rule,
it has to be a fax number. Your pathetic argument on unincorporated
associations and legal liability has just gone bang Alex.

AWL> The Telephone Book is a publication of Telstra, and
AWL> includes information on Telstra customers published as
AWL> part of the contract between the customer and Telstra.

Yes, pity thats utterly irrelevant to the question of legal liability tho.

RS> And being part of that list, or part of the very large group of
RS> people who have a phone, doesnt do a thing to his legal obligations
RS> as far as risks from people suing Telecom etc are concerned.

AWL> Becasue they are a customer of Telstra. Are you saying
AWL> that a NodeListed Sysop is a customer of FidoNet?

Nope, I am saying that being part of a list does not make you liable
to legal liability for what another person on that list does.

AWL> Is the money Fred Nurk pays FidoNet (as contributing Sysop to the
AWL> N640 mail fund) income - no, becasue Fred is a member of FidoNet.

PE> I applied for a Fido node number, and got listed in the nodelist.

AWL> You made an application for Nodelisting

RS> Yes. Again, saying precisely what he said in different words.

AWL> Probably right. Is it clearer if I say it as "an
AWL> application for membership, so that [he] may be
AWL> nodelisted" or doesn't that make it clearer?

Nope, its just a useless as far as any legal liability
for what someone else on that list might or might not do.

AWL> and became a Member of FidoNet when that took place...

RS> NOT in the sense of any legal liability risked because
RS> of something some other person with a node number does.

AWL> The Nodelist is the membership list for FidoNet.

Irrelevant to the question of legal liability.

RS> Just like with a phone line, there are some technical
RS> requirement to comply with, no fee to pay in this case,

AWL> Not so.

Fraid so.

AWL> Becoming a customer of Telstra involves entering a contract
AWL> for services with them. Becoming Nodelisted involves becoming
AWL> a member of FidoNet. Nothing like the same thing...

Fraid so as far as any legal liability for what
another person on that list might do is concerned.

RS> no problem with being legally liable for what
RS> others who also have a node number might do,

AWL> So you keep asserting.

And you keep failing to grasp.

AWL> However I can't help but feel that the Courts will not agree.

It doesnt surprise me that you feel that Alex. When I have seen
a wide variety of utterly ludicrous claims you have made on what
'the Courts' might find, it doesnt surprise me in the slightest.

AWL> Members of associations are liable for the actions of the association

Pity you havent actually managed to show that Fido is an unincorporated
association which has that effect with the actions of another member.

AWL> (and thus its management) and that liability is only limited when
AWL> the association incorporates. Members of unincorporated associations
AWL> accept unlimited personal liability for any debts of the association.

Pity you havent been able to show that Fido *IS* an unincorporated assoc.

RS> just like you arent legally liable for what another
RS> person who ALSO has a phone does with HIS phone.

AWL> Telstra are not liable only by virtue of the Act that created them.

Pity I was talking about another phone user. Not Telstra.

AWL> FidoNet Nodelist *does*not*equall* telephonebook...

PE> Yes it does.

AWL> So because I can use the HREOC to force
AWL> Telstra to provide disabled friendly service

RS> Because the government has imposed that on Telecom.

AWL> No Rod,

Yes Alex.

AWL> because the Government has imposed that on every
AWL> organistaion, incorporated or not, Government owned
AWL> or not in the land. That's what the DDA means Rod.

Nope, your claims about that are complete and utter tripe.
The group of droid housewives that choose to meet on the
beach cant have some dork like you proclaim they cant meet
there coz you cant use your wheel chair there.

AND Fido already has provided a way of using it that you can use coz
you are using it aint you ?  Your claim is fucked before it starts.

AWL> then I can do the same to FidoNet?

RS> Nope, because they already have a disabled
RS> friendly service, to wit the point system,

AWL> A point sysop is expressly forbiden to take part in some Sysop Echos.

Whoopy fucking do. You aint a node sysop, so you dont qualify Alex.
Many organisations say allow only the salesmen to attend particular
meetings, not the cleaners. If you are a cleaner, you are SOL Alex.

AWL> That is a restriction that HREOC will probably rule unlawful.

Nope, its complete and utter tripe.

(Continued to next message)

--- PQWK202