-=> On 20 Sep 96  06:33 you wrote to me <=-
 GG>>         While I would agree a JVC receiver is anything but "high-end," 
 GG>> I don't think one should lump all receivers or integrated amps into
 GG>> consumer-grade oblivion.  There is *no* reason why a low to medium
 JA>         I am the last man to flame anyones setup or tastes in
 JA> equipment or  software. I would be the happiest man alive if I
 JA> could be completely happy  with a $49 Walkman! Then I would have
        I don't think anyone is suggesting that you should be happy
with a $49 walkman.  That is not what I was talking about in the
least.  I was saying that because a receiver is a receiver or an
integrated amp is an integrated amp is no reason to infer that it
automatically is inferior sound wise.  While I have a degree in
electronics, I am by no means an audio engineer.  But you can go on
r.a.he. and ask *several* audio engineers about this subject, if you
like.  The fact that there are many cheap receivers out there should
have no bearing on receivers in general except to say there are some
bad sounding receivers out there.  This does not mean there are no
good ones.
        You could just as easily say that "seperate" transport and D/A
converters generally are better than stand alone CD players.  I know
a very respected individual on r.a.he. (Stewart Pinkerton) that would
gladly reeducate you in this matter for very valid scientific
reasons.
 JA> a CD collection the size of Yellowstone  Park. I do encourage
 JA> anyone to take the time to visit someone with a good  system or a
 JA> dealer with a good setup and reputation to introduce them to  
 JA> "better audio". No snobbery, just better sound. I also encourage
        That's fine advice, except it would seem to be in response to
my claim that receivers not need sound inferior to seperates in a
system that doesn't need hundreds of watts to drive inefficient
speakers.
 JA> performances they can  possibly attend. That is how I began. I
 JA> stumbled around for years not having  a clue of what good home
 JA> audio really was. I am just now beginning to learn  some of the
 JA> finer points and often feel overwhelmed by the entire subject.   
        I just don't want to see you get drawn in by some of the
comments made by largely unscientific and ignorant individuals working
for so called "high end" magazines out there.  They are *far* from the
authority on electrically engineered products.  Let's take a look at
the reasons you meantion.
 JA>     There are many arguements for seperates versus integrated
 JA> that cover  everything from interference, vibration, heat
 JA> disipation, on and on.
        These can all be measured.  Some magazines employ these
excuses without the slightest bit of proof to back themselves up.
Interference is easily shielded, vibration has little or no effect on
solid-state components (it could be dampened internally if it was
needed anyhow) and heat dissipation is generally not a real problem in
low power amplifiers (say 100 watts a channel or thereabouts or less).
Heat dissipation is *the* reason to go with seperates with high power
amplifiers.  
        There are good products and there are bad products out there.
There are good seperates and there are bad seperates.  Likewise, there
are good receivers and bad ones.  I agree with the "go listen for
yourself" advice, but I would refrain from broad, general comments on
"good or bad" when dealing with things like seperates.  Ideally, the
only real difference between the same version of a seperate component
and an integrated one is a sheet of metal.
 JA>        I have nothing against these dealers. Nor are all higher
 JA> priced  dealers offering better demos. But it rubs me very raw to
 JA> enter one of these  places and hear someone really looking for
 JA> better sound and hear the crap the  sales people fill them with. 
        I agree.  But once again, this has no bearing on my comment
about receivers and integrated amplifiers.  I fully agree mass market
chains are *not* the places to audition equipment.  Because they
typically sell integrated components does not mean all integrated
components are bad.  
 JA>        Better they take a shot at a dealer carrying better
 JA> quality gear, for a  demo, than to be satisfied by some 16 year
 JA> old salesman with a trunk flapper  mentality.
        Yes, but this also doesn't mean a quality intregrated amp
couldn't be waiting for them at that dealer.
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... "Goodbye Blue Sky" -Pink Floyd
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