>>> David Martorana on "Biological Consciousness" 
 DM>> What I meant was that "merely human" consciousness is physical
 WE> A conjecture without any substantive evidence one way or the other.
 DM> I think we can develope enough circumstantial evidence to satisfy
 DM> me (at least for now), I don't know how much or what kind you would
 DM> be willing to accept or even explore.
We could relate consciousness to the aura, the electromagnetic field thruout 
and about the body.  But then animals especially and plants also exhibit this 
aura.  It is easy to show how the aura depends upon metabolism, tho that is 
not a certainty when you consider brain death.  Also you have some difficulty 
distinguishing inanimate consciousness from animate if that distinction is 
important.
 WE> Yup without consciousness there'd be no universe that I'd be
 WE> concerned about.
 DM> Agreed as a condition of death when what you say becomes true.
Sleep or any other unconscious state relieves you of universal concerns.
 DM> I *think* the universe would still be there and not caring
 DM> whether you're concerned or not. Perhaps a mite selfish as
 DM> "conscious thought" while others alive, might still be concerned
 DM> with the universe. 
A popular universal anthropomorphic image, that the universe cares about you. 
 Some among the living may be concerned about, that's about all you can 
expect.  Consciousness is needed for even this expectation.  Otherwise, what 
expectant you is there.
I DO struggle with this puzzle of transitory
 DM> importance whereas we, individual or species, do make a bit of
 DM> noise and poof, we AND our consciousness are gone. As long as I'm
 DM> *alive* I would find the universe interesting whether my
 DM> consciousness is biological (likely) or some more or less unknown
 DM> other... It is all some fun while lasting "....our species, our perk"
You understand that a definition of life and consciousness has little to do 
with being alive or consciousness beyond an intellectual problem for our 
musing.  
 DM> NOTE: If we are including *religious insights* into the
 DM> "consciousness packaging", I back off     
Have a sip of Zen:
   Someone asked a master: "What happens after death?" 
   He said: "I dont't know, I'm not dead yet". 
........such of private
 DM> wisdoms *presently* seeming alien to what I can believe. Also! some
 DM> years back, my wife during high fever, experienced an "out of body
 DM> experience" that she said seemed "life real". In it she looked down
 DM> upon herself. We never thought it more than a dream type happening
 DM> (Mentioned as an only shot at consciousness projected out of its
 DM> fleshen roots). Though I oft read about such "otherish" notions of
 DM> "consciousness", (things akin to near death experiences), I remain
 DM> some ............skeptical. 
There's conjecture aplenty about this.  I like the notion of memory 
discharges.  She remembered the appearance of her body which was strongly 
visualized.  The same with a dead dear one, with stress can come a vision of 
the deceased.  Again a memory being vividly visualized.
 DM>> Consciousness is some fuzzy for me to nail down, but as I said
 DM>> originally, it does not  "knowingly" exist beyond the life of
 DM>> its container, and so would suggest reasonable assumptions.
 
 WE> From prehistory to tomorrow, there's no available definition.
 DM> WE might ANYWAY *work with* some assumed (still fragmentary) models
 DM> and a bit of reasoning. Such an approach might be first steps in
 DM> deciphering "consciousness" into what I believe is just another
 DM> (much more novel) physical organ (or your "perhaps" MORE in a
 DM> developing view).
There's little to be said.  It can be turned off and it be started and 
restarted.  Our experience indicates that it is associated with life.
 
 WE> A good knock on the head will give you a 'less of it', and for
 WE> 'more of it', a bucket of cold water.
 DM> .....yes that might work .....I'll assume we either don't agree OR
 DM> mutual clarity is not likely at this time. ..............Pardon' ?
This less and more of terminology is not useful.  Consciousness can be 
stopped by a knock out blow to the head and it can be revived by a bucket of 
cold water, as losing boxers can assure.
---
---------------