KR> i dont know about shotguns, they certainly legislated about
KR> automatic pistols. i saw a program on tv about when i was in the
KR> us, all new magazines have a set maximum capacity, i think 9 rounds.
KR> older 15 round magazines are legal but they can't sell new ones.

RS> Quite a bit of that US law has just been reversed.

KR> which parts?

Most of that sort of stuff like magazine capacity, and
the other stuff about military style long arms, in the
Congress. The vast bulk of US gun law is state law anyway.

BG> I for one flatly refuse to sleep here without a weapon
BG> underneath the bed, so that every man and his dog can
BG> walk in and shoot, rob, or rape my family.  Fuck that.

KR> thats called paranoia bill (:

BG> Call it what you like Keith, but as they STILL haven't found the prick who
BG> murdered the woman 2 doors down the street (8 months ago now), the fact
BG> that there is a gun in my house lets me sleep at night, and Lyn actually
BG> feels even more strongly about it than I do. We've also had fuckwits
BG> driving around our suburb firing heavy calibre guns from their car two
BG> nights in succession now, and tonight probably won't be any different.

BG> As far as I'm concerned, it is my basic human right
BG> to be able to protect myself and my family from
BG> predators, and if I need a gun for that, so be it

KR> statistics seem to show that, if someone is going to
KR> bump you off, its most likely to be a rellie, or friend,

RS> Yes, but FIVE times as many of those are done with other than a gun.

KR> probably less than 1 in 5 homes have a gun.

Hard to say, particularly those where the inhabitants are
much more likely to kill each other. No one really knows.

KR> a gun easily to hand facilitates that.

RS> Thats the claim, pity the evidence to substantiate it is so
RS> completely fucked tho. Tiny problem with Switzerland, Israel,
RS> Sweden etc where they do have full military assault weapons in
RS> their homes in massive numbers and they dont get that result.

KR> i dont have any problem with people who want to go target
KR> or skeet shooting, or feral animal hunting having the guns
KR> that they need, as long as they are securely stored.

RS> Soorree, YOU dont get to proclaim in what you do or do not have
RS> a problem with. WE get to decide what we want to do on that stuff.

KR> oh the royal plural again your majesty.

You'll go blind if you dont watch out, in this case its everybody
who gets to decide what they will do on guns, not you.

KR> it must be nice being the queen of hearts,
KR> although the mad hatter would be more appropriate.

Soorree, you dont get any say on what others do on guns.

And you dont get to run this pathetically bogus line when
we have had very relaxed gun laws for over a hundred years
and the murder rate has been static for the last 50 either.

KR> that would stop one supply of guns,

RS> Bullshit it would, you might care to explain how, when
RS> we have had handgun laws much more strict than what we
RS> propose now with long arms, that it hasnt done that.
RS> And hasnt got within a bulls roar of doing that either.

KR> and what levels of handguns are there out in the community then.

No one really knows, like with most illegal activity. Clearly there
are heaps tho when they are used so often in armed robbers etc.
You can buy one anytime, for about the price a VCR costs too.

KR> it is even distinctly arguable that much care is taken in handing
KR> out handgun licences anyway, almost anyone in the security industry
KR> can get one, there have been some very interesting exposes on that.

Its still a lot stricter than anything proposed for long arms in the new gun
laws, so clearly they wont be able to achieve a better result will they ?

RS> Ditto poms, they have had much lower levels of guns in
RS> homes than us for a long time, didnt stop Dunblane tho.

KR> there is no way that you can totally rule
KR> out stuff like that only reduce it's likelyhood,

Whatever thats supposed to mean. You were raving on about the
benefit of reducing the numbers of guns in homes. The poms have
much lower numbers of guns in homes than we have, and the murder
rate in scotland is the SAME as ours. So clearly the availability of
guns isnt relevant is it ? It clearly didnt avoid Dunblane did it ?

KR> also the poms have been much laxer in
KR> *enforcing* their rules in recent years.

Pigs arse they have. And whatever they have done on enforcement, they
STILL have a much lower number of guns in homes, and the murder rate
is STILL the same as ours, so your line on availability has imploded.

KR> it would apear that the tassie loony stole
KR> his gun from an insecure gun collection.

RS> And if that was not possible, he could have just bought them,
RS> he was rolling in it. That just happened to be convenient.

KR> how come it was more convenient?

If you cant grasp the convenience of obtaining
the guns from someone you know has them...

KR> would it have happened if these guns had not been available?

Pity there aint no way to achieve that, the handgun law shows that
very clearly indeed, MUCH more stringent than anything we plan with
long arms, and completely trivial for anyone who wants one to get one.

Yes, it may at times be more convenient to just pinch them instead.

I've binned your pathetically juvenile stuff. Again.
@EOT:

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