01 Jun 06 13:40, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Roy Witt:

 MvdV> Hello Roy.

 MvdV> 30 May 06 12:06, you wrote to me:

 MvdV>>> P4 was written with little or no concern for the situation
 MvdV>>> outside Z1 period.

 RW>> I'm sure that it wasn't, but then, there's been too many
 RW>> interpretations that are in error from Z2.

 MvdV> Who is to judge what interpretations are in error?

Those who's knowledge of the English language is superior to those who's
knowledge is second hand, interpreted into, let's say; Dutch. To interpret
that which you claim is not your native tongue makes you the lasser
interpretator.

 MvdV> We have no independent judges and the original writers have all
 MvdV> left.

I'm still here.

 MvdV>>> For one it tacitly assumes local calls are free.

 RW>> And they are.

 MvdV> In most parts of the US and Canada. In most other parts of the
 MvdV> world local calls are not free.

So says you. Only in urope do they charge you for a long distance call
across the street.

 MvdV>>> So it does not matter who calls who when it comes to the host's
 MvdV>>> obligation of delivering incoming routed mail.

 RW>> The host isn't obligated to deliver routed mail, only coordinate
 RW>> it's delivery or pickup.

 MvdV> Right....

 RW>> It's been my experience that a host will require those sysops under
 RW>> it to fetch their own mail from the host or hub.

 MvdV> A requirement that is outside policy and therefore falls under the
 MvdV> header of a dictatorial decree.

Wrong. Your interpretation isn't what P4 says, nor what happens in
reality.

 MvdV>>> In Z2 local calls are *not* free and so it does matter who
 MvdV>>> calls who. That is just one example, there are many others.

 RW>> As I described it above.

 MvdV> Dictatorship....

Wrong.

 RW>>>> Of course, but many of them didn't know best and they had no
 RW>>>> common sense. Many of them ran their nets and regions like a
 RW>>>> dictatorship...

 MvdV>>> Actually in the past when FidoNet was run by the technicians,
 MvdV>>> the *C's ever so often *did* know best.

 RW>> Ummmm, those were the dictators I pointed out above.

 MvdV> A dictatorship *can* be an effective way to run something. It has
 MvdV> proven to be the best way to run a ship...

And urope.

 RW>> It is only lately that things have been freed up.

 MvdV> Unfortunately in most cases the dictatorships were replaced by
 MvdV> anarchie.

Archie who? Oh, you meant anarchy...see what I mean about English skills?

 MvdV> Which got us from the fire into the frying pan.

But, we were already in the frying pan.

 MvdV>>> Now that the technicians have left and the politicians have
 MvdV>>> taken over, it has become a free for all with little or no
 MvdV>>> regard for what once was called "the smooth operation of the
 MvdV>>> network" .....

 RW>> I find the network is operating smoother than it has in the past.

 MvdV> Really?

Yes.

 MvdV> It has become a free for all.

How so?

 MvdV> The nodelist is a mess and does not reflect reality,

Not many people these days pay much attention to the nodelist.

 MvdV>  routing ever so often leads into a black hole,

Due to the mess in the nodelist, no doubt.

 MvdV>  *Cs are asleep with their system on autopilot,

I know two who have been asleep for years and yet their nets and regions
don't miss them. Ever wonder how it would be like to want to contact an RC
with your modem and their phone number is not listed? Look up RC10 and
RC15 sometime. I know RC10 is there because I Binked his node for two
months before he finally passworded me out (I probably woke him up one
day). RC15, well, I have a session password with her system, but I'll bet
she doesn't know I'm still connecting there.

 MvdV>  universal connectivity is down the drain.

We have nodes outside the planet?

 MvdV>  I think the network is on the verge of collaps.

Not as long as there are two nodes passing mail.

 RW>> Nobody is enforcing ZMH, for instance.

 MvdV> And that, is not an improvement. Ignoring ZMH is detrimental to
 MvdV> connectivity IMNSHO.

For an ION node, it isn't necessary. That was proven by an RC when she
declared that all RINs and NCs must connect with her system at least once
a week, or be excommed from the nodelist.

 RW>>  Well, maybe in Z2.

 MvdV> Hardly. In the past NCs used to do regular checks to see if the
 MvdV> nodes were still on-line. Now many are afraid for what they will
 MvdV> find: black holes. So now they refrain from checking lest they
 MvdV> would have to strike half the nodes from their nodelist segment....
 MvdV> :-(

Ahh, so that's why the Z2 segment looks stuffed...


Roy
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