BL> Historically, northern Korean falls iunder the influence of
 BL> China, southern Korea under Japan.

 KR> the koreans that i have known seemed quite fiercely
 KR> nationalistic. they dont borrow much from any of their
 KR> neighbours, with their own language and writing. they neither
 KR> seem to like china or japan (the latter being quite
 KR> understandable given the japanese national sport of invading
 KR> korea). 

  Quite true, but so is what I wrote. It's like the French falling
under English influence; they fight it furiously but can't avoid it.

 KR> i dont quite see what it had to do with vladivostok

  The Russians do not have an ice-free port in the Pacific and the
only free passage from Vladivostok is south through the Korea Strait.
Both Japan and Korea control that passage. With a communist Korea and
land access to Pusan, the Russians would have the East China Sea and
nothing to stop them. America is basically a naval power... as England
was.

 KR> , i think that the yanks were using the same thinking as in
 KR> vietnam of the domino theory. 

  The domino theory was the 60's. Korea was ten years earlier.

 KR> i've never had much time for mcarthur, he didn't match up to
 KR> patton's soldiering or ike's organisational ability, even if he
 KR> did wear cool shades (: 

  I grew up under the idea that Macarthur saved Australia and was god.
As a child I admired three great men (and the Phantom): Churchill,
Macarthur, and Montgomery. I read everything I could about them,
including Churchill's 19?-volume history of WWII when one of the
engineers at Pye was given the full set for his birthday.

  Out of this study I now admire Roosevelt, Nimitz, and Patton (and
nice Lord Louis Mountbatten). Macarthur and Montgomery were fuckwits
and Churchill was basically evil (but the right man for the job). I
don't even think Macarthur was a good general. Nimitz was the genius
in the Pacific, not Macarthur.

  Macarthur failed to hold the Philippines and left with his entire
force taken, he failed at Buna with the Australians cleaning up, took
West New Guinea against no opposition and walked into the Philippines
the same way. The real fighting was somethwere else. He rebuilt Japan
against America's best interests, fucked up in Korea, confronted the
Commander in Chief and and then got sacked by telegram. Great career.

 BL> I think the Chinese would have invaded anyway, willing to
 BL> settle for half or anything they could get. Korea has always
 BL> been basic to the balance between China and Japan, north and
 BL> south.

 KR> i dont think so, they laid it out ahead of time - stop there or
 KR> we join in, mcarthur didn't so they did. several thousand
 KR> people may much longer lives if not for a nutty us general
 KR> seeking glory. 

  True. But even so, I think China wanted to flex its new communist
muscle and its lovely new weaponry from Russia. Without the threat
of the H-bomb and the example of Horoshima, they might have taken all
Korea.

 BL> I still wonder what would have happened if the US had tested
 BL> the new H-bomb on Peking rather than Bikini atoll, the way
 BL> Macarthur wanted.

 KR> several large areas of the us and russia may have started
 KR> glowing at night. 

  Not at *that* time. There was a period around the Korean War when
Russia did not want a nuclear confrontation. It passed. That was the
wiondow of opportunity Macarthur wanted to exploit. He thought he
could take China. What a fuckwit!

 BL> To me, China is the most dangerous of all, Communist and
 BL> growing rich besides.

 KR> china is less and less comunist, just despotic, and that may
 KR> change with the riches flooding in, it is historically
 KR> difficult to dominate a rich country, indeed it may get more
 KR> and more difficult to keep china as one country. 

  Yes... it splits into North, South and West. Many times.

  I agree with that old joke: Christianity and Communism are great
ideas; what a pity no one ever tried them. Communism was never the
Marxist vision of communism; it was just another form of despotism
with a huge bureacuracy to make it work, and the Marxist philosophy to
give the fuckwits something to believe. Marxism was the opiate of the
intelligentsia. Capitalists have more fun with cocaine.

  I can see China splitting in three but I can't see the bureaucracy
letting go, not while they control capitalism through licensing,
corrupt practises, and such.

 BL> I think in 20 more years we may be saying that Macarthur could
 BL> have stopped it. 

 KR> you have a strange sense of morality, vapourising several
 KR> hundred thousand chinese to ensure commercial advantage 40 odd
 KR> years on. 

  It's the Viking blood. What d'yer mean several hundred thousand? I
was thinking around 20 million: Peking, Shanghai, and Canton just for
a start. I'd try not to pollute the atmosphere too much though. I'm a
committed ecologist who loves small furry animals... 

Regards,
Bob
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
@EOT:

---