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| subject: | Re: Sarah`s Christology Jn 1:1-18 |
======== Continued From Previous Message ========== ; occasionally applied by way of deference to magistrates; and sometimes as a superlative:--angels, exceeding, God (gods)(-dess, -ly), (very) great, judges, mighty. 1. (plural) a.) rulers, judges b) divine ones c) angels d) gods 2. (plural intensive - singular meaning) a) god, goddess b) godlike one c) works or special possessions of God d) the (true) God e) God Strong's number 2316 'theos' of uncertain affinity; a deity, especially (with 3588) the supreme Divinity; figuratively, a magistrate; by Hebraism, very:-- exceeding, God, god(-ly, -ward). BAGD: (parentheses *theirs*) theos 1. of divine beings generally 2. Some writings in our lit. use the word theos w. ref. to Christ (without necessarily equating Christ with the Father). 3. of the true God 4. *fig.*, of that which is worthy of reverence or respect (ancient Roman children had to call their parents theoi). 5. of the devil 2 Cor 4:4 Thus, the words originally used in the Bible that in English translate as "G/god" allow for a greater semantic range than some would wish. Or does anyone here know of a lexicon/dictionary that gives only "true god" or "false god" as the only definitions of 'elohim/theos'? So the accusation of 'polytheism' is thus a false one, according to Scripture. Most study Bibles reference this to Prov. 8:22, which, in the Bible John would have used, reads: "Jehovah *created* me the beginning of His ways for His works. From everlasting He established me in the beginning, before He formed the earth, and before He made the depths, and before the springs of waters came forth, before the mountains were settled; He begets me before all the hills." Prov 8:22 LXX The preexisting 'sons of God' shouted in applause at the creation of heaven and earth (Job 38:7) They obviously preexisted earth's creation, but did not necessarily exist into eternity past. The heavenly hosts were created before the earth. There are no "all of God" or "part of God" statements in the Bible, they are simply not there. Jesus Christ plainly identified the one true God as the Father ONLY at John 17:3. And to Jews who were of course familiar with the Scriptural use of 'elohim' in the Hebrew Scriptures and 'theos' in the LXX, this would not be a statement of polytheism, for these words have different shades of meaning, as I have repeatedly pointed out, (and been repeatedly ignored). An interesting point on John 1:3: Ginomai occurs upwards of seven hundred times in the "NT", but never in the sense of create, yet in most versions at John chapter 1, it is translated "made." Ginomai appears fifty three times in John, and signifies "to be, to come, to become, to come to pass; also, to be done or transacted." Egeneto (a form of the word 'ginomai') NEVER carries a creation meaning and is never translated such outside the four times rendered such in the first chapter of John (John 1:3,4, & 10) where it is translated "made". When the Bible refers to God, the only reference is to the Father. Repeatedly, the Bible uses the term "God the Father." I know of no Bible translation where one will one find "God the Son" or "God the Holy Spirit". If I have missed any that do, I know someone here will be more than pleased to tell me. In John 20:28, the definite article is used when Thomas confesses, "My Lord and my God." Which would make vs 17 a lie and vs 31 an anticlimax if indeed Thomas meant that Jesus was, in fact, Jehovah God. Quite unlikely, since he had observed Jesus bow his head in prayer to God. And heard him proclaim that he was *taught* by God (John 8:28). What would Almighty God need to "learn"??? "There is no objection to referring to Jesus as "God," if this is what Thomas had in mind. Such would be in harmony with Jesus' own quotation from the Psalms in which powerful men, judges, were addressed as "gods." (John 10:34, 35; Ps. 82:1-6) Of course, Christ occupies a position far higher than such men. Because of the uniqueness of his position in relation to Jehovah, at John 1:18, Jesus is referred to as "the only-begotten god." None of this denied Jewish monotheism, for even imperfect humans were referred to as elohim as God's appointed agents. How much more so the unique, firstborn Son of God! The context helps us to draw the right conclusion from this. Shortly before Jesus' death, Thomas had heard Jesus' prayer in which he addressed his Father as "the only true God." (John 17:3) After Jesus' resurrection Jesus had sent a message to his apostles, including Thomas, in which he had said: "I am ascending . . . to my God and your God." (vs.17) After recording what Thomas said when he actually saw and touched the resurrected Christ, the apostle John stated: "These are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in his name." (John 20:31) So, if anyone has concluded from Thomas' exclamation that Jesus is himself "the only true God" or that Jesus is a Trinitarian "God the Son," he needs to look again at what Jesus himself said (vs. 17) and at the conclusion that is clearly stated by the apostle John (vs. 31)." John was not a "ranking" Jew, he was a simple fisherman, among those who were sneered at by the "ranking" Jews as "unlearned and ignorant". (Acts 4:13) John records Jesus' refutation of the charge of blasphemy at John 10:34-36: Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your law, 'I said, you are gods'? If he called them gods to whom the word of God came (and scripture cannot be broken), do you say of him whom the Father consecrated and sent into the world, 'You are blaspheming,' because I said, 'I am the Son of God'? So if judges in Israel could properly be called 'gods' because they were God's representatives, how could anyone accuse Jesus of "blasphemy" simply because he said he is God's Son? The doctrine that is supposedly 'the keystone in the arch of Christian truth' would reasonably be mentioned in Scripture at least once, and plainly. The identity of the God of the Bible is not something that can be left to "implication" or "development" over several centuries by means of creeds. This all-important doctrine would be plainly spelled out, over and over, yet, do we find 'trinity' (or 'trias') or any equivalent thereof? NO! Think on these questions: 1) Why would the Bible only "imply" what Trinitarians say is its central doctrine? 2) Why would the "central doctrine" of the Christian religion have to be "developed" and added centuries later? 3) Why would the loving God NOT make clear a doctrine whose belief would determine one's eternal life or death and eternal torments? (as I am told by most Trinitarians). What IS found in Scripture is the personal name of God, nearly 7,000 times, more than any other name in the Bible. Yet, how is this Name treated by today's most popular Bible translations? It is *removed* without apology. Clearly, the name of the true God is unpopular for some reason. The very *few* ocurrences of the names of false gods are retained, however. It is quite interesting that Satan never once uses Jehovah's Name, but just calls Him "God". But Jesus quotes extensively from Scripture where God's Name appeared. "Orthodoxy" is defined by Scripture ONLY. Not creeds. Not anathemas. Just Scripture. First-century Christianity was a persecuted minority, viewed as 'heresy' by "orthodox" Judaism. Not even the preaching of the perfect Son of God could change that, so obviously Jesus Christ meant what he said at Matt. 7:13, 14: "Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are *few* who find it." Nowhere does the Lord Jesus Christ say that fact would change. If the majority did not listen even to the Son of God, how can his imperfect human followers expect to do better? So when Christians became "orthodox" by an unholy alliance with pagan Rome and became persecutors themselves, they disowned Christ, who said: "But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven; for He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? If you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same?" Mat 5:44-47 Keep in mind that the Scriptures are "inspired of God" and are to be used for "setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work." (2 Timothy 3:16, 17) So the Bible is complete in doctrinal matters. If the Trinity doctrine is true, it should be there. I invite all to search the Bible, especially the 27 books of the Christian Greek Scriptures, to see for yourself if Jesus and his disciples taught a Trinity. As you search, ask yourself: 1. Can I find any scripture that mentions "Trinity"? (After all, the "keystone in the arch of Christian truth" could reasonably be expected to merit at least one mention in Scripture). 2. Can I find any scripture that says that God is made up of three distinct persons, Father, Son, and holy spirit, but that the three are only one God? 3. Can I find any scripture that says that the Father, Son, and holy spirit are equal in all ways, such as in eternity, power, position, and wisdom? Beyond a doubt, the Trinity doctrine has confused and diluted people's understanding of God's true position. It prevents people from accurately knowing the Universal Sovereign, Jehovah God, and from worshiping him on his terms. As theologian Hans Küng said: "Why should anyone want to add anything to the notion of God's oneness and uniqueness that can only dilute or nullify that oneness and uniqueness?" But that is what belief in the Trinity has done. Those who believe in the Trinity are not "holding God in accurate knowledge." (Romans 1:28) That verse also says: "God gave them up to a disapproved mental state, to do the things not fitting." Verses 29 to 31 list some of those 'unfitting' things, such as 'murder, strife, being false to agreements, having no natural affection, merciless.' Those very things have been practiced by religions that accept the Trinity. For instance, Trinitarians have often persecuted and even killed those who rejected the Trinity doctrine. And they have gone even further. They have killed their fellow Trinitarians in wartime. What could be more 'unfitting' than Catholics killing Catholics, Orthodox killing Orthodox, Protestants killing Protestants-all in the name of the same Trinitarian God? Yet, Jesus plainly said: "By this all will know that you are my disciples, if you have love among yourselves." (John 13:35) God's Word expands on this, saying: "The children of God and the children of the Devil are evident by this fact: Everyone who does not carry on righteousness does not originate with God, neither does he who does not love his brother." It likens those who kill their spiritual brothers to "Cain, who originated with the wicked one [Satan] and slaughtered his brother."-1 John 3:10-12. Thus, the teaching of confusing doctrines about God has led to actions that violate his laws. Indeed, what has happened throughout Christendom is what Danish theologian Søren Kierkegaard described: "Christendom has done away with Christianity without being quite aware of it." True Christians will have peace with one another, as only the love of the Christ can conquer hate: "For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh (for the weapons of our warfare are not of the flesh, but mighty before God to the casting down of strongholds)" (2Co 10:3, 4) "Now I beseech you, brethren, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfected together in the same mind and in the same judgment." (1Co 1:10) "Bless them that persecute you; bless, and curse not." (Rom 12:14) "Repay no one evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all. If possible, so far as it depends upon you, live peaceably with all. Beloved, never avenge yourselves, but leave it to the wrath of God; for it is written, "Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord." No, "if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him drink; for by so doing you will heap burning coals upon his head." Do not be overcome by evil, but *overcome evil with good*." Rom 12:17-21 Find the faith that practices these things, and you will have found the geniune followers of Christ. Peace to you and yours in this violent world. Read the NWT online at http://www.watchtower.org/bible/index.htm ((( s.r.c.b-s is a moderated group. All posts are approved by a moderator. ))) ((( Read http://srcbs.org for details about this group BEFORE you post. ))) --- UseNet To RIME Gateway {at} 3/2/05 10:15:24 PM ---* Origin: MoonDog BBS þ Brooklyn,NY 718 692-2498 (1:278/230) SEEN-BY: 633/267 270 5030/786 @PATH: 278/230 10/345 106/1 2000 633/267 |
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