SK> As moderator, let me welcome you to the EDUCATOR echo. I fear that you
 SK> are coming in on the tail end of a discussion, and have missed
 SK> substantial comments that Charles has made, so you may be
 SK> misinterpreting his post.
With your response in mind, the remarks that still ring in my ears are:
-> CB> As I said - no one *needs* to write programs
-> CB> today the operating commands are not so totally integrated with
-> CB> the programming language, as in the early TRS machines, that one
-> CB> needs to have some basic understanding of computer "programming",
I would like to see some response that might help me to see that this is not 
totally blind and negatively productive bunk.  With all the junk programs 
being purchased today, we definatly DO need writers.
DOS 7.0, WIN95, NT, MAC, and yes, even OS2 are all operating systems that 
profess "user friendliness".  What tripe.  What is happening with society is 
probably what has been happening to Charles.  He is being detuned in that he 
is learning how to work for the computer (and not vice versa) and therefore 
seems to believe  that:
-> today the operating commands are not so totally integrated with
-> the CB> programming language, as in the early TRS machines, that one
-> needs to CB> have some basic understanding of computer "programming",
 SK> He is only questioning whether it is necessary to make it
 SK> part of the required curriculum for ALL jr. high (middle school)
 SK> students, or maybe offer more as an elective for those who are
 SK> interested.
It should be every bit as necessary as a fundamental math course.  Some 
colleges even give language (such as Spanish or French) credit for learning a 
programming language.
 SK> While I can see benefits to having all students take that type of
 SK> course, Chuck has actually taught such courses and seen a fair amount of
 SK> frustration on the part of students, so he has good reason to suggest
 SK> that it not be required.
I suspect that the problem really lies in curriculum development.  Any course 
can be excrutiatingly fustrating if it is presented wrong.  I question every 
computer instructor's background in programming.  If they have only been 
"promoted" from math or science department, the students most likely are 
going to be fustrated.
--- DB 1.58/003138
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