From: Ellen K. 

Don't be ridiculous.   Of course you test, you test everything you can
think of and then some.   And then there will still be bugs in the
initial release.

A developer who claims his or her apps never have bugs reminds me of the
saying of my late father (a lawyer) that the lawyer who's never lost a case
has probably never tried one.

On Sun, 18 Jul 2004 11:13:55 +0100, Adam Flinton
 wrote in message :

>Ellen K. wrote:
>> Oh please.
>>
>> No matter how much you test, there will still be bugs in the initial
>> release.
>>
>
>In which case there will always be bugs in every release so why bother
>to test?
>
>Adam
>
>> On Thu, 15 Jul 2004 18:11:36 +0100, Adam Flinton
>>  wrote in message
:
>>
>>
>>>Rich wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>   It may not be economical if testing is simply not something that
>>>>these folks care about.  The actual change is a tiny part
of releasing
>>>>an update.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Indeed. MS have to be masters of major updates as they have to do it all
>>>the time.
>>>
>>>However wrt testing the best time & place to do that is before it
>>>becomes part of the product & not after it's been released
which is what
>>>the openbsd people tend towards vs the marketing driven cycle in
>>>evidence wrt MSOS'es.
>>>
>>>Adam
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Rich
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>    "John Beamish"  wrote in message
>>>>    news:40f69bc7{at}w3.nls.net...
>>>>    (I'm not running Linux.)
>>>>
>>>>    I find that statement "economical with the
truth".  Assume that you
know
>>>>    which module to go to.  Check it out, make the change,
check it in,
>>>>    recompile it, do regression testing (assume the change works and
doesn't
>>>>    break anything), update module documentation, update
changelog, update
>>>>    bugtracking.   In any serious environment, that's a
day's work -- not
an
>>>>    hour.
>>>>
>>>>    What happens next?  Are Linux users expected to d/l the
recompiled
>>>>    module or
>>>>    is there a process to compare the previous version with the new
>>>>    version and
>>>>    generate some kind of hex patch which gets downloaded
and applied?
>>>>    Or what?
>>>>
>>>>    Thanks.
>>>>
>>>>    "Adam Flinton" >>>    > wrote in message
>>>>
>>>>     > Security information moves very fast in cracker
circles. On the
other
>>>>     > hand, our experience is that coding and releasing
of proper security
>>>>     > fixes typically requires about an hour of work --
very fast fix
>>>>     > turnaround is possible. Thus we think that full
disclosure helps the
>>>>     > people who really care about security."
>>>>     >
>>>>     >
>>>>     > etc.
>>>>     >
>>>>     > Adam
>>>>
>>
>>

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