->  ->  MM> Oh yes, Windows DOES do that!  :-((  If it fails to
see the drive for
->  ->  MM> any reason, it believes there is no data to be careful
of and starts
->  ->  MM> the installation with FDISK.

-> THAT is your _first_ problem.  I'd start with rechecking the ribbon
-> cable connections.  Maybe use a 40-wire cable for starters, as a check
-> on that 80-wire cable.  The 80-wire isn't needed until the drive starts
-> running in UDMA66 mode, which happens after the windows drivers for the
-> card are installed.

I've already done both despite the fact an 80 line cable merely has
extra grounds to prevent crosstalk.

->  ->         Windows does FDISK ?

->  WC> The OEM CD does.

-> I think not in every case.  See what Tom Walker said, and I know that
-> the Upgrade version of Win98FE does not run FDISK in every case.  
   
Well it's why I emphesized yhe OEM CD in my posts and private e-mail to
you, it was precisely that which had concerned me, with justification.

-> You
-> may well have something wrong in your Tomsrtbt Fdisk setup.  
   
If so it's of no concern or impact as that disk sits unused in 
storage.
I used the fdisk in Knoppix Linux which I KNOW is perfectly fine
both as it's well known to be stable and from personal experience.
The same cannot be said for the fdisk that comes with the original
release of Microsoft Win 98 fdisk which is well known.

-) My guess is
-> that your OEM disc may have run FDISK because it didn't see your Winders
-> partition as C:.  You need to fix that, too.       

Heh.
It's BECAUSE it saw C: it messed up the drive.
Had Windows not seen C: I'd have no problem here.

-> Here's what I had to do to get HDD on Promise card here seen as C: -
-> Go into setup - disable onboard IDE controller _primary_ channel only.     

I DID this however as the Promise Ultra card lacks hardware
CD drive support there was no way to load my software.

-> See screen where it shows former HDD parameters - erase the CHS and
-> landzone parameters by toggling to NONE.  This last was required here in
-> order to even proceed thru POST.  Leave the onboard secondary channel
-> enabled, and use that to access your CDROM drive for software
-> installation. 
   
I DID this as well,

-) After I did that, the HDD on the Promise card is seen as
-> drive C:.
                   
If it hadn't seen C: I'd have no problem with the drive.
I should have just toggled it type 83, set active boot with "a" 
and ibstalled Linux alone.

->  ->  MM> If I read all of this correctly, Wayne's system now no
longer 'sees'
->  ->  MM> the drive at all.  If this is true, he will most
likely have to put it
->  ->  MM> on a newer system first that will 'see' the drive just
to be able to
->  ->  MM> zero the MBR.

-> That was my idea also.  I'd be glad to help you with that if I lived
-> nearby, and will do it for you if you finally give up on the drive and
-> want to ship it parcel post up here to me.  But I know you live near to
-> Ed Koon, and I'd bet he would be willing to give you a hand with it if
-> you ask him nicely, as I know he has been kind to you over the years.

->  ->         Wayne has some hope for his HD as he said that he is keeping
->  ->   it to install it as slave on another system. Then he would be able
->  ->   to do an FDISK on his own and then format the HD again. That would
->  ->   redo the MBR.    

I'd use the Western Digital hard drive utility.
It's currently downloaded to /home/knoppix/tmp
where it is of no use at all as it's not Linux O.S.
compatable.
Can't even copy it to a floppy as it's 100K too big.

->  WC> I was thinking Roy's advice might have some value in the
->  WC> command line syntax he provided but on rethinking it
->  WC> if fdisk /dev/hde doesn't see the drive his zeroing syntax
->  WC> won't see it either :-(

-> Back up top to your _first_ problem.  
 
My FIRST problem was in following your advice and not my instincts
when you e-mailed me "you're so cautious you're borderline paranoid.

My caution evidently was well founded.

I hate to be so harsh but you insist on keeping telling
me stuff contrary to what I KNOW went wrong.

-> You'll likely not get anywhere
-> until the HDD is autodetected by a BIOS attached to an IDE controller.

Which it likely never will be again.
The last ditch effort will be to temprarily slave it to    
another drive and run WD's lifeguard tool.

-> But (and I think this is important) is "hde" the equivalent
of C: drive?
-> If not, maybe _that_ could be the reason your OEM Winders ran FDISK?

Type 0C in Linux fdisk IS C: as p ( print to console) the partition
clearly showed.
It was only when Windows hit the drive the problem occured.

->  WC> What Jim Holsonback fails to see is there's no inherent HARDWARE
->  WC> ATAPI support for the CD drive in the Promise Ultra66 card.
->  WC> Told he's looking at a system running Windows on the same type
->  WC> promise card is meaningless as it's right there in the
->  WC> documentation that Windows and Promise drivers are compatable
->  WC> doesn't help in the least if your software is on a CD.

-> Sheesh!  Gimme a break, man.  You have no idea what I see and what
-> I fail to see.  I'm the one got the Promise card installed to
-> Windows and got the CDROM drive to working from it. But, one thing I
-> _do_ see it that there is no inherent HARDWARE ATAPI support for CDROM
-> drives in DOS mode, either. Driver (like Oakcdrom.sys) is required,
-> along with running MSCDEX.exe. 
   
Uh, my other ISA Promise card had hardware ATAPI support
as does the Belkins card I'm looking to purchase.
Both those cards manuals clearly state they are hardware 
ATAPI compliant, the manual at Promise, support, archive, Ultra series,
Ultra66 DOES NOT.

-> The Promise card sees HDD just fine, and
-> loads Winders OK, with no drivers. I guess they didn't make DOS based
-> drivers for the card, so installing the windows drivers, _after_ windows
-> is installed, is required for CDROM and UDMA66 support. If you have read
-> the Q&A from the Promise website, you know this already.  The DOS-based
-> CDROM drivers on the Win98 startup diskette don't work for CDROM drive
-> attached to the Promise card because it doesn't use "standard
-> resources."   

-> FWIW, after WinFE is installed, 

Keyword "after."

-> with onboard secondary channel still
-> enabled, I can jump the CDROM drive back and forth from the Promise
-> card secondary to the onboard controller secondary, with no additional
-> hardware detection and driver installation steps.  Win98FE just
-> recognizes and supports the drive, whichever controller it is
-> connected to.

Linux recognized the drive just fine, Win 98 OEM software killed that.

-> Good luck.  I'm still thinking your HDD isn't dead, just needs some
-> CPR to get it ticking again.

I'll put this in the same drawer as your previous advice received in
e-mail.
--- Platinum Xpress/Win/WINServer v3.0pr5