-=> Quoting David Martorana to Clarence Hogan <=-
 @@> On March 22-98 Clarence Hogan wrote to David Martorana                   
 
 DM> Msg #798, @@> "Boxes & Awkward Text"
... .......>>>=======>  MD2SP  <=======<<<.......
 CH> But David, from what I have been able to understand about the virtual
 CH> world of the Internet's Cyberspace, has it not already reach the level
 CH> of the "HOLODECK" interaction with people and is it not already here?
 
 DM> I become ever less certain of what a "real world" means; that
 DM> somewhere in a mix of OUR perceptions and NATURE'S options,
 DM> I am floating in a ~SOMETHING-SOMEWHERE~ package of limited
 DM> sensing, at best only poetically clear (to me). 
 
 All I can say in truth is that this is not the "real world" IMHO!
 For in my limited understanding of it all, if this were the "real
 world", I for one would not wish to live eternally in it under 
 the present circumstances that we are presented with and living in!
 DM> As to your above
 DM> comment "already reach...", it is correct to a point, but not
 DM> explored beyond a comparison LIKE modern TV with a crystal radio.
 
 I noticed that if failed to include the "ed" with reach, it it
 ain't my brain getting behind, it is my fingers!  ;)  To me, the
 "real world" is truly in the mind and in the mind alone and these
 bodies are truly a bad dream of our minds which are only temporary
 servants to our minds and only bind us to the temporal world that
 we presently live in, but the mind, which I believe is the real us
 will one day be released into it's natural realm of the "real world"
 that I have eluded to!  And if one truly thinks about it in depth
 as I believe that I have, one could see that even the crystal radio
 was indeed a early type of HOLODECK, crude but effective within it's
 limits!  Did I muddle that up enough?
 DM> I would expect in the next few  years to converse with someone, not
 DM> just across the presently configured cyberspace comms, but in a
 DM> very special sense of synthesized physical reality [holodeck]-
 DM> like meeting in a tavern in Nepal or on Mars, sitting down and
 DM> having a conversation with real??? or "established" others.
 
 And I would expect the same thing, but IMHO, it will still be only
 within the mind which is as real as it will ever get IMHO!  IOW's
 in my mind, whatever is constantly changing cannot possibly be
 rationalized as "real"!  And by the same token, I do not consider
 my mind "real" so long as it is constantly changing, but once it
 has settled in, so to speak, and has found the truth of the matter,
 then and only then does it become a real and lasting mind!  But to
 my knowledge, there has been only one who has reached the "real"
 realm of the mind and the rest of us are still trying to reach that
 realm!
 
 DM> Assuming we don't self destruct (or are so done in  by an unhappy
 DM> first principal), I believe that the "concept edges" of reality will
 DM> dominate and greatly expand in that coming world ....that we are
 DM> in a short twilight about to enter what today we might render as
 DM> alien ...an unknown mission?.  
 
 And IMHO you are truly not far from the truth of the matter if I
 understand what you are saying!
 DM> I have no way of knowing the goods
 DM> or bads of it all, or even if such concerns have meaning as we
 DM> know them. As with many of our few dissimilar views , though
 DM> the "REAL" in reality is reasonably clear to you, it is "big time"
 DM> less so to me.
 
 I am of the same mind set as you in that vein, as I have not
 fully come to the conclusion that there is good and bad to 
 it all, but I am suspect that there is no bad, but only good
 in the overall scheme of things and if there is any bad at all,
 it is of our own making and does not truly have to be so!  And
 although it appears confusing to us now, I firmly believe that
 once we discover and realize what is truly "real" there will be
 only good and no bad whatsoever!  However, I am also aware that
 it is indeed a path of realization that each of us must travel
 alone in this present realm which aids in the elusiveness of it 
 all but at the same time also aids in the realization of it all!
 DM> There IS an extra awkwardness that WE face because of the
 DM> belief systems we have adopted as our base of being and our
 DM> understanding of the "whatevers" that contain us!  
 
 If my understanding of what you have said here is correct, you
 have hit the nail squarely on the head!
 DM> I do wonder
 DM> that we can even share our exploratory notions without some
 DM> "false-to-peacful" tensions .........some kindly but mutually
 DM> incompatible work-of-words.  
 
 It is indeed a monumental task, but not impossible IMHO!  IMHO,
 if people would only say what they truly mean and mean what they
 say by just laying aside their prejudices and pre-conceived ideas,
 teachings, notions, etc., then the accomplishments would truly be
 astounding!
 DM> Never been real comfortable that
 DM> dissimilar mind basics can be bridged (sure has had a rough
 DM> history).
 
 Sadly, it is indeed apparent that some never will, but I do not
 believe that is true of the majority who would be true seekers
 of the truth when approached in a truthful and honest manner!
Just another humble servant of The Kingdom.......clarence.......
... One does not have to be right to be truthful do they?  
--- Blue Wave/DOS v2.30
---------------