MA> A choice to starve and live in a perpetual state of
 MA> poverty, or to take risks, struggle against seemingly
 MA> unsurmountable odds, and do all that can be done to have a
 MA> better life. 
RC>Irrelevant to the point: it is *his* choice.
 
       I recognize it is a choice.  I simply cannot criticize a man for
making the same choice I would, the same choice our own ancestors
themselves made, faced with the same set of circumstances.
 MA> No not brought in in chains, just as fleeing slaves did not
 MA> flee to free states in chains, but, like we once captured
 MA> fleeing slaves, chained them, and forced them back into the
 MA> chains of slavery, we are now capturing those fleeing
 MA> hopelessness, chaining them, and forcing them back into the
 MA> chains of hopelessness.
RC>Nice hyperbole, but irrelevant to the facts.
 
       Is it?  Are my words inaccurate or merely inconvienent?
 MA> In both cases, those seeking hope and liberty, followed the
 MA> nothern star in hopes of realizing their dreams. In both
 MA> cases, those who wrap themselves in unjust and inhumane
 MA> law, armed and deadly, stand in their way. 
RC>Again, more hyperbole. The liberality and openness of US
RC>immigration policies are exceeded by very few countries. 
  
      For northern europeans, possibly, but for others I will contest
your position.  We were, at one time, as Jefferson described if, an
island of liberty in a sea of servitude where all who love liberty may
seek refuge, but no more.  Our immigration policy is now extremely
restrictive and not even close to being one of the world's more open
systems.
      Unless, for example, you are a professional with specific skills,
an immediate family member of an American citizen, or marry an
American, there is no means by which most Latin Americans can ever come
to the United States legally.  The idea, widely held, that all that
needs be done is apply and wait is a myth.  Unless you are among these
limited few, and even then the wait can be over a decade, there is not
even a waiting list.  No means is available.
      The same person, however, can, of they choose, immigrate to over
a hundred other nations by one means or another.  
 
       The United States is one of, if not the most, restrictive nation
in the world on immigration.  Very few others guard their borders with
armed patrols using sensors and night vision to hunt down civilians. If
you really believe we are an open nation you need to look a bit harder
at the system you are defending.  Such a belief is ill-founded.
RC>Bounty hunter? Hardly. Just as *they* expect me to obey the
RC>laws of *their* countries when I visit, I expect *them* to
RC>obey our laws (which are on the whole, far more liberal
RC>than their own).
 
        The important difference here being that they let you visit.
There are very few nations in the world that would not welcome you if
you choose to visit and then decide to live in that nation.  We, on the
other hand, are among those very few despite our supposed belief in
liberty.  We dare claim that all men are endowed by their Creator with
certian inalianable rights, among them, life, liberty, and the pursuit
of happiness, and then, distort these profound words to mean "yea...but
not here".  Either we believe in these profound principles or we do
not.  I happen to believe in them.
 MA> From the perspective of the man, woman, or child, being
 MA> tracked by armed men with dogs as they desperately seek
 MA> refuge from the torment that has been their life in the
 MA> lands of the north where liberty is said to flourish, I
 MA> suggest the differences are insignifigant. 
RC>It always easier to flee than to fight... but it tends to
RC>become a habit. Just as their first act in this country is
RC>to disobey the law. Good precedent. NOT!
 
         We are a people who have a long and distinguished history of
disobedience of unjust laws.  In fact, we honor those who struggled
against injustice as our most sacred national heros.  Jefferson and
Washington and Franklin and all the founders of this Republic defied
the law in it's very birth.  Lincoln defied the law to preserve it.
King defied the law to brings the benifits of liberty to all Americans.
There is no shame in defiance of injustice.  Defiance of injustice, in
this nation, is as much a responsibility of each citizen as casting a
vote.
         As for preferrring to flee rather than fight, such a statement
disavowes the honor of our own ancestors.    Yes, they did flee tyrrany
rather than oppose it at home to enjoy the fruits of liberty, but once
those fruits were found resolute defense of it's preservation has never
been an issue.   If you question, in particular, the resolve of
Hispanic immigrants and their offspring to defend the liberty of this
nation you need only look at the list of those who have one this
nation's highest award, the Medal of Honor.  In a totally
disproportional number to any other ethnic group, Hispanics have
verified their commitment to liberty with unmatched courage.
         Ther is no grounds to question the willingness of these
immigrants to defend their chosen land.  In times of need they have
demonstrated their resolve to do so beyond question. 
 
                                    Mike Angwin
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