From: "Rich Gauszka" 

Nope - not my position at all. I expect modifications in surveillance and
law enforcement  but I also expect them not to be bulldozed through in a
climate of fear without regards to the ramifications of those changes to us
as a free people. The scare tactics from this administration will probably
reach another peak in the coming months as the elections near. I fully
expect a class of terrorist 1st graders to be exposed and arrested in
August

Hoekstra is from my state Michigan and in the live interview I saw with him
on our local 10 pm news today he was still upset


"Mark"  wrote in message
news:44b1bf0e{at}w3.nls.net...
> You're carrying over the last conversation into this one, I still disagree
> on that thread, but, Hoekstra isn't upset about the programs being
> implemented, he was questioning the fact that he hadn't been briefed on
> this one or that in a timely manner. That's since been corrected and the
> papers are highlighting the wrong points in his letter IMHO.
>
> We invented the Internet and turned it loose on the world, our enemies are
> thanking us very much and using it against us. Your position seems to be,
> c'est la vie, let it rock and roll; let our enemies use our creation
> against us because it's some terrible affront to our freedom and privacy
> if we are to monitor the use of our creation by our enemies that want us
> dead and buried and as soon as they can do so.
>
> Hell, what an odd time to say we shouldn't watch them using our Internet
> when we just foiled a plot to take out thousands of commuters on PATH from
> NJ to NY *by doing just that*. I remain willing to have them find out that
> I like Skippy Natural "no need to stir" Peanut Butter if it
means they can
> save my life on the way to work.
>
> "Rich Gauszka"  wrote in message
> news:44b1b956$1{at}w3.nls.net...
>> Even the FBI admitted to mishandling information that could have detected
>> the terrorist pilots prior to 9/11. That you see the need for us to give
>> up liberties for this bureaucratic incompetence astounds me.
>>
>>
>>
>> "Mark"  wrote in message
>> news:44b19348$1{at}w3.nls.net...
>>> Oh c'mon Rich, we've revamped our intelligence apparatus in a big way
>>> since 9/11, when they didn't stop the plot, as they didn't in the first
>>> WTC attack, and there are bound to be oversteps/oversights in this area
>>> or that, it's going to take awhile to get it all together properly.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Rich Gauszka"  wrote in message
>>> news:44b18e09$1{at}w3.nls.net...
>>>> Good grief Mark - The world is as it's always been - only
the names of
>>>> the 'bad' guys making the threats have changed.  Agencies charged to
>>>> protect us have made arrests and stopped plots well before
Bush was a
>>>> thought. The frightening event in the future is the
dissolution of our
>>>> liberties and not some amorphous bogeyman.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Mark"  wrote in message
>>>> news:44b18877$1{at}w3.nls.net...
>>>>> That the internal whistleblower thing worked the way
it was supposed
>>>>> to (up until some ass leaked the letter itself) is a good thing.
>>>>> Hoekstra also said there's no way that they can/want
to be briefed on
>>>>> every single program, he felt these should have made the cut.
>>>>>
>>>>> What this tells me, is that we're in a transition
phase adjusting to a
>>>>> new world-wide threat and it's going to take some time
to get it all
>>>>> sorted out (via squabbles such as this one and Supreme
Court input in
>>>>> other areas, as well as continuing adjustments in the way other
>>>>> agencies and departments communicate).
>>>>>
>>>>> I just don't see how this transition can be expected to be
>>>>> accomplished with no missteps at all, but, eh, let's
blame Bush. 
>>>>>
>>>>> This part of his letter, however, is what I found
interesting and
>>>>> quite disturbing:
>>>>>
>>>>> "In fact, I have long been convinced that a
strong and well-positioned
>>>>> group within the Agency intentionally undermined the
Administration
>>>>> and its policies.  This argument is supported by the Ambassador
>>>>> Wilson/Valerie Plame events, as well as by the string
of unauthorized
>>>>> disclosures from an organization that prides itself
with being able to
>>>>> keep secrets.  I have come to the belief that, despite
his service to
>>>>> the DO, Mr. Kappes may have been a part of this group.
 I must take
>>>>> note when my Democratic colleagues - those who so
vehemently denounced
>>>>> and now publicly attacked the strong choice of Porter Goss as
>>>>> Director - now publicly support Mr. Kappes's return."
>>>>>
http://justoneminute.typepad.com/main/2006/07/hoekstra_cia_gr.html
>>>>>
>>>>> What we've got going on, I think, is a plethora of
power struggles,
>>>>> and it ain't purty and it ain't making us safer or
expediting the
>>>>> elimination of terrorist groups around the world. So I
wish they'd all
>>>>> swallow their egos and kiss and make up >>>> freezes over>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Rich Gauszka" 
wrote in message
>>>>> news:44b17a2e{at}w3.nls.net...
>>>>>> Well now the Republican chair of the House
Intelligence Committee is
>>>>>> saying it. Perhaps Bush really likes to play
'Twenty Questions'
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=politicsNews&storyID
=2006-07-09T143910Z_01_N09148126_RTRUKOC_0_US-SECURITY-INTELLIGENCE.xml
>>>>>>
>>>>>> WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Bush administration was
running several
>>>>>> intelligence programs, including one major
activity, that it kept
>>>>>> secret from Congress until whistle-blowers told the House of
>>>>>> Representatives Intelligence Committee, the
committee's chairman said
>>>>>> on Sunday.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Rep. Pete Hoekstra, a Michigan Republican who
chairs the House
>>>>>> Intelligence Committee, said on Fox News Sunday he
had written a
>>>>>> four-page to President George W. Bush in May
warning him that the
>>>>>> failure to disclose the intelligence activities to
Congress may be a
>>>>>> violation of the law.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In doing so, he confirmed a story that first ran
in Sunday editions
>>>>>> of the New York Times.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "I take it very, very seriously otherwise I
would not have written
>>>>>> the letter to the president," Hoekstra said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "This is actually a case where the
whistle-blower process was working
>>>>>> appropriately and people within the intelligence
community brought to
>>>>>> my attention some programs that they believed we
had not been briefed
>>>>>> on. They were right," said Hoekstra, a close
ally of Bush.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "We asked by code name about some of these
programs. We have now been
>>>>>> briefed on those programs but I wanted to
reinforce to the president
>>>>>> and to the executive branch and the intelligence
community how
>>>>>> important by law is the requirement that they keep
the legislative
>>>>>> branch informed of what they are doing," Hoekstra said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The White House declined to comment directly on
the allegations in
>>>>>> Hoekstra's letter. "We will continue to work
closely with the
>>>>>> chairman and other congressional leaders on
important national
>>>>>> security issues," said Alex Conant, a White
House spokesman.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Critics have charged that the Bush administration
has a penchant for
>>>>>> secrecy and has pushed its legal powers to the
limit and possibly
>>>>>> beyond in pursuing its "war on terror."
But Hoekstra's complaint was
>>>>>> particularly significant since it came from a
strong supporter of the
>>>>>> administration's tactics.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hoekstra complained in his letter to Bush that the
U.S. Congress
>>>>>> "simply should not have to play 'Twenty
Questions' to get the
>>>>>> information that it deserves under our Constitution."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the letter and the interview, Hoekstra did not
provide details
>>>>>> about the programs, which presumably remain secret.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hoekstra had been briefed about both the National
Security Agency's
>>>>>> domestic surveillance program and the Treasury
Department's tracking
>>>>>> of international banking transactions, both of
which were leaked to
>>>>>> the media.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> He said he did not expect to be briefed about
everything intelligence
>>>>>> agencies were doing but at least one of the secret
activities was a
>>>>>> major program which Congress definitely should
have been informed
>>>>>> about.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the letter, Hoekstra said the lack of disclosure possibly
>>>>>> constituted a "breach of responsibility by
the administration, a
>>>>>> violation of the law, and, just as importantly, a
direct affront to
>>>>>> me and the members of this committee who have so
ardently supported
>>>>>> efforts to collect information on our enemies."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

--- BBBS/NT v4.01 Flag-5