From: Ad 

Geo. wrote:
> Well I guess it's going to take one more election to make it clear then..
>
> Geo.
>

Not just an election but other realities as well:


http://www.turkishpress.com/news.asp?id=179458

"The general man who commanded US-led coalition forces during the
first year of the Iraq war says the United States can forget about winning
the war.

"I think if we do the right things politically and economically with
the right Iraqi leadership we could still salvage at least a stalemate, if
you will -- not a stalemate but at least stave off defeat," retired
Army Lieutenant General Ricardo Sanchez said in an interview.

Sanchez, in his first interview since he retired last year, is the
highest-ranking former military leader yet to suggest the Bush
administration has fallen short in Iraq.

"I am absolutely convinced that America has a crisis in leadership at
this time," Sanchez told AFP after a recent speech in San Antonio,
Texas.

"We've got to do whatever we can to help the next generation of
leaders do better than we have done over the past five years, better than
what this cohort of political and military leaders have done," adding
that he was "referring to our national political leadership in its
entirety" - not just President George W. Bush.

Sanchez called the situation in Iraq bleak, which he blamed on "the
abysmal performance in the early stages and the transition of
sovereignty."

He included himself among those who erred in Iraq's crucial first year
after the toppling of the Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein. "



"Sanchez, 56, declined to talk about Abu Ghraib or other key events of
the war, or say who was to blame for what went wrong.

"That's something I am still struggling with and it's not about blame
because there's nobody out there that is intentionally trying to screw
things up for our country," he said. "They were all working to do
the best damn job they can to get things right."

Despite those good intentions, Americans will be forced to "answer the
question what is victory, and at this point I'm not sure America really
knows what victory is," said Sanchez, who is thinking of writing a
tell-all book about his year in Baghdad.

The US ambassador in Baghdad, Ryan Crocker, reacted on Sunday to Sanchez's
comments by insisting: "It's just way premature to be talking in terms
of victory or defeat."

"What we're trying to do here is stabilize the security situation,
particularly in Baghdad, to allow a political process some time and space
to work," he said on Fox News.

He said time was needed for Bush's "surge" strategy, launched in
January, of ploughing thousands more troops into Iraq "to make a
difference on the streets and then time for this political process to
unfold."

Sanchez said a large troop commitment would be needed for years to come but
conceded it is "very questionable" whether Americans would
support it.

Still, he said, "the coalition cannot afford to precipitously withdraw
and leave the Iraqis to their own devices." "


Hmmmm "Who we paleface?"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=459
613&in_page_id=1770

"British military chiefs have drawn up plans to withdraw from the two
remaining bases in southern Iraq by the end of this year - effectively
ending the UK's five-year operation in the country.

The timetable is set out in an official letter to the Iraqi government in
Baghdad, the Daily Mail has learned.

It would see the last two UK bases at Basra Palace and Basra Airport handed
over to local control before Christmas.

The plan represents a far faster withdrawal than expected and will put
British ministers on a collision course with Washington, where the UK's
presence as a loyal ally in the controversial war in Iraq remains highly
valued. "


As far as most UK ppl I know are concerned....certainly in the South...sod
em If Basra goes up in flames then the guys waving the torches will be the
Basrawi so it's their town & if they want to live in cinders that's
their choice.

Adam




> "Gary Britt" 
wrote in message
> news:4662f181{at}w3.nls.net...
>> Geo, you are wrong the country didn't send the message we want to
>> declare defeat and surrender in Iraq.  It sent a very different
>> message still backed up by current polling.  The message is we want to
>> WIN in Iraq OR if we can't win then we want to get out and we want one
>> or the other very soon.
>>
>> Sending the surge troops to Iraq which is definitely having a positive
>> effect on destroying the enemy or more of the enemy is a good thing.
>> Not an example of Bush's incompetence.  Their are plenty examples of
>> Bush incompetence, that just isn't one of them.
>>
>> Gary
>>
>> Geo. wrote:
>>> "Glenn Meadows"  wrote in message
>>> news:46619384$1{at}w3.nls.net...
>>>> IMO, Your statement should read:
>>>>
>>>> "..if he just was able to make CORRECTLY INFORMED
decision".
>>>>
>>>> I believe most of the time he's getting the WRONG information, not
>>>> that he's making the incorrect decisions.  I think the information
>>>> is flawed and suspect, so that based on the info he gets, one could
>>>> justify his decisions. It's GIGO at the highest levels now.
>>>
>>> No I don't believe that. Nobody can be that stupid. The American
>>> public sent him a clear message at the last election, we want out of
>>> Iraq and so he sends in more troops.
>>>
>>> Clearly the man got the information, since he acted, so I think it
>>> more likely that he is just too stupid to make a correctly informed
>>> decision because he makes the decision then looks for information or
>>> interprets information so that it supports his decision.
>>>
>>> Geo.
>

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