Theo Markettos wrote on 7/19/2017 6:50 PM:
> Another Dave  wrote:
>> Yes. I understand the Linux boot process. I'm simply quoting Andrew
>> Tanenbaum, the author and still developer of Minix, who said that he
>> chose the beaglebone for ARM development because it was more open source
>> than the Pi. I therefore expressed a wish, and I'm not the first, that
>> more of the Pi's drivers were open in the spirit of the subject of this
>> thread.
>> If you think he was wrong and that you can help, then his email is
>>
>> astanenbaum@gmail.com
>>
>> In addition I'm not sure that it's in the spirit of Minix that there's a
>> whole load of abstraction to a closed blob of any part of the kernel
>> processes.
>
> Fair enough, if you can only support one platform then you have to pick one.
> But the Pi GPU firmware is essentially similar to a PC BIOS - and people
> don't insist they can't use a PC unless the BIOS is open source.

The PC BIOS *is* open source, at least the original BIOS was accessible to
anyone who bought the technical reference manual.


> I should be clearer about this: there is a high chance that almost every
> hardware component of any complexity you talk to has a processor of some
> kind inside running software - that you don't get the source to.  That
> includes the BBB.  A lot of that software is in ROM that you can't change.
> You communicate via a defined API - maybe that API uses registers over MMIO
> or I2C or whatever, but it's still an API.  So it's not fair to single out
> the Pi with its GPU, which is essentially no different.

I don't know what "fair" means.  People have said there is *less* of the BBB
that is not open source.  Are you disputing that fact?


> Now, there are projects for making fully open source SoCs - eg SiFive and
> lowRISC, and they (will be) great for learning platforms.  Likewise there
> are open source FPGA systems.  However today you can't buy a fully open
source
> SoC of the Pi class.

Ok, but there are other platforms with less software that isn't open source,
no?


> But do I need the source code for (eg) my touch screen controller?
> If it gives me X, Y and number of fingers, that's probably all I need it to
> do.  I'm not going to be booting Linux on it or mining bitcoins.

I thought you were talking about the rPi, why bring your touch screen
controller into it?


> Parts of the Pi hardware have open-source drivers but not open-source
> documentation - which is a different problem, and I can understand that
> makes it less attractive.  It is, unfortunately, a problem shared with a lot
> of other SoCs (TI are one of the better vendors in terms of documentation).
> If that's the reason then it's understandable.

Your logic doesn't follow.

--

Rick C

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