On 13/01/2021 21:20, Joe wrote:
> On 12 Jan 2021 19:01:47 GMT
> TimS  wrote:
>
>> On 12 Jan 2021 at 07:41:00 GMT, Jan Panteltje
>>  wrote:
>>
>>> Kill all old people, those are a burden on society anyways?
>>
>> The true burden on Society is people who spell "anyway" as "anyways"
>> or "lose" as "loose".
>>
>
> Almost all problems throughout history have been caused by the ruling
> class, whether they were monarchs or politicians.
>
> Politicians claim to solve problems, but they are almost always problems
> that were created by other politicians.
>
I think they are almost always the problems caused by those very same
politicians themselves.

If you want to get re-elected to e.g. mount a 'war on poverty' it is
handy if you have created a lot of it first. before handing over the
reins to the other lot, who you can subsequently blame for it.

But it is not true to say that ruling classes caused the problems -
ruling classes are a response to problems, if not a total solution.
E.g. the Feudal system grew out of an age where primary wealth was
agriculture. And the primary problem was that the only energy available
was 'renewable' so that human or animal labour on crops and in managing
livestock was  the only real source of it, Without surplus food you
couldn't afford to educate anyone or indeed have anyone doing stuff like
making metal implements - sloughs and hoes and sickles, let alone the
armour and swords necessary to defend it from people who discovered that
stealing someone else's food is a lot easier than growing your own.
Social order, some form of effective de facto, if not de jure, slavery,
and a hierarchy with  a warrior class on top and an educated
priest/scholar class pretty high up, with artisans like metal workers
being a cut above agricultural workers was a price you had to pay for
being alive at all.

Now with abundant fossil and nuclear energy and machines replacing the
slaves, we all have the luxury of prognosticating over how socially
unjust it was and congratulating ourselves on having got past it.
Without realising that it was in fact the optimal solution... yea even
unto stuffing God notions in there to keep the whole thing stable...for
the conditions that existed at that time, and that by and large the
advances that moved us out of it were technological, not religious or
political.

Politics is really about which flavour of the same elite gets to piss on us.

Never about the real issue which is how much of a ruling elite do we
really need and can we afford them?

And how do we in fact get rid of them without putting something equally
bad in its place (Trump?) or having a civil war...which usually benefits
no one but the next ruling elite.

When you look at all the massive examples of gross political change -
the fall of the Roman empire, the invasion of the Normans, the French
revolution, the Russian revolution, the end of apartheid, the
independence of Zimbabwe, Venezuela, Cuba...what strikes you is how much
worse the populations were afterwards and often for a long time.

Politicians manage problems. Technology generally solves them. It wasn't
Marxism that eradicated the working class, it was machines and fossil fuel.




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Truth welcomes investigation because truth knows investigation will lead
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