In article ,
 "Hyerdahl"  wrote:

> Mark Sobolewski wrote:
> > In article ,
> >  "Hyerdahl"  wrote:
> >
> > > mark_sobolewski{at}yahoo.com wrote:
> >
> > > I guess that's why Russian women pay so much for American blue
> jeans.>
> > > :-)  Right.
> > > >
> > > > Yeah, like... 20 years ago! :-)
> > >
> > > No, it's true even today, and Russian women love blue jeans still.
> >
> > So if it's so true, give an example of a price that
> > Russian women are paying. :-)  (While you're at it,
> > try to find your NRA lifetime membership card :-)
>
>
> Well, to prove that Russians like blue jeans I don't have to supply a
> price, and, as you know, jeans come in all different styles and prices.
> Here is what one travel cite has to say about blue jeans in Russia:
>
> http://www.oksanas.net/FAQ.htm
>
> "The obvious answer is to be you. Many have been surprised to see how
> nicely Russians dress in everyday life, though recently blue jeans have
> become a dominant fashion trend. If you want to fit in and be less
> obvious in a crowd, some black pants, and black shoes will help. Sport
> coats are common with well-to-do men..."  My NRA card has never been
> any of your business, Mark.

And this proves that jeans are expensive, how?

About your NRA membership card: What NRA membership card? :-)

> > > > It's funny to hear you suggest that foreign brides
> > > > are going to have their hearts and minds won by
> > > > feminist values once they hit American shores when you
> > > > have such a condescending, incorrect view of their culture.
> > >
> > > There is nothing "condecending" I have said (or
feel) about Russian
> > > culture, but it is obvious to me that poverty stricken Russian
> women
> > > sign up to marry American strangers, and yet American women don't
> feel
> > > the need to do the same.
> >
> > Ever hear of eharmony.com?
> >
> Sure, but that isn't about buying a submissive spouse;  that's just
> about finding a dating venue.

So these women don't date strangers? :-)

> Most people, today, are simply too busy
> with their careers to find time for meeting people the same way they
> did before women worked outside the home.

Yeah.  OK.  It was so much easier for women to meet
men back, er, when they were at home all day. :-)

> Although, many people meet
> their mates at work, I suppose.

Before Anita "coke can" Hill, certainly. :-)  Work
was the double-dipper's playground for meeting
"non-sexist" provider men.

>  And eharmony.com is used by BOTH sexes
> whereas, only insecure men seek submissive women from poverty stricken
> countries.

Yeah, Donald Trump is really insecure. :-)

> > > > As I said, times have changed since the politically incorrect
> > > > days of foreigners' accents being made of and them being
> > > > expected to assimulate into WASP values ASAP.
> > >
> > > I can't speak for your friends (if you have any), but I can assure
> you
> > > that mine would no more laugh at your mail order bride's accent
> than
> > > they would at her Levis.  :-)
> >
> > That would be rather difficult since she doesn't own a pair. :-)
> > I think she does have some Italian jeans.
> >
> Well, that's all personal conjecture on your part, Mark, but I have
> nothing against Italian jeans either.

What conjecture?  I see the closet everyday.  There's
no LEVIS in there for either of us.  For that matter,
there's no mention of Levis in the cite you provided either.

> In fact, I'd have to look but I
> may also own a pair.  :-)  Jeans are part of American culture
> regardless of where they're manufactured.  Most folks agree with that.

Yeah, I guess I'll have to take your good word for
most folks agreeing with you there.  :-)  When it comes
to Italian designer jeans, it's part of American culture.

> > Probably the LAST thing most modern Russian immigrants
> > come for is the "culture".
>
> Most people "come" to America for what they perceive to be a 'better
> life' and that does include American culture.

Gee, you really should make a lot more money than a former
legal secretary considering how you have your thumb
on the pulse of what "most people" think.

> I have an acquaintence
> whose family is from India...but he was raised in Pakistan.

And he's as real as your NRA membership card. :-)

> He was not
> able to practice his skill (physical therapy) as he wanted to in
> Pakistan, so his family moved here.  He came here with next to nothing,
> and was embraced by American people who helped him start over.  Today,
> he's a multimillionaire and his family has attributes from both
> cultures.  One of his daughters is very involved with Indian dance, and
> the other is a lawyer.  Both have western dress and Indian dress.
>
>   Many of them are in shock> at how dirty and dilapidated the inner
> cities are and the low > level of public manners and discourse.
>
> So am I.  :-)  In a land as rich as ours, one would think we'd find
> ways to edcuate our people better, but then, we wouldn't have the
> government we do.

Indeed.  DC has one of the highest rates of per capita spending
per pupil yet most wind up ready-made for the prison system.

That's the "metro" system in action.

>  One friend of mine > from Moscow broke down and cried when he saw what
> L.A. really  looked like.
> >
> Well, LA is pretty spread out;  there are many places to "look".
> However, if you've ever been to Venice, I understand many people come
> away thinking it more of a sewer system than how it has been depicted
> in the Las Vegas
> 'Venetian'. :-)  America tends to have the best and the worst society
> has to offer.  We have more violent gun-related murders here as well.

He now lives in a section of the city where it doesn't
have such an ethnically diverse population.  A side
effect is that the gun-related murder rate is incredibly
low...

> > With the internet and 10 cents a minute telephone rates,
> > most people in for the former USSR know that America is
> > nothing like Baywatch or even "Sex and the City".
>
> Only the job-related parts of NYC are like "Sex and the City", and
> that's sort of a microcosm of its own in the scheme of things.  And I
> agree, there is no "Baywatch", not in real life, but there are
> lifeguards.  I spent some time in Sydney last year and took a ferry to
> a very nice beach with lifeguards.  A pretty high school girl wanted to
> have her picture taken with two lifeguards and they agreed.  She was
> facing the camera, and she had one guy holding up each of her arms
> ...with pants pulled down.  :-)  I guess she wanted a silly tourist
> picture.  I couldn't believe they said ok.
> :-)

Wow!  That's a great story!  You ought to write fiction!

> > I was laughing at propoganda from the metrovsretro.org
> > leftists claiming the blue states were enlightened
> > towers of progress with the "retro" states people
> > living on farms and trailer parks.
>
> :-)  Well, each of us has an opinion on that, and we are free to decide
> for ourselves whether it's "propaganda".  We get the government we
> deserve, and if we fail to educate our populace, the government we
> deserve will be the govt. we are educated to expect. Don't you agree?

I guess you should talk to the voters in the district about
how they managed to waste all that money.

>  In realty, the inner cities where leftism is the strongest
> > are, at their best, office towers where most workers flee
> > for the suburbs at night.
>
> Again, it really depends on what you love.  In the SITC program, the
> gals loved NY.

My wife likes it too.  For visiting.  But for most
people with a normal income, it's laughable to try
to have a life there.  (Especially with all the high
paying jobs fleeing the city for New Jersey or the
South.)

> Mark, now that you're residing in ...DC...you and your
> alleged bride should try to take a couple of days this spring, to see
> NYC when the buds are on the trees.  You will probably also enjoy the
> Japanese cherry trees lining parts of DC.   Both are lovely.  I could
> easily live in a big city like NYC or enjoy the peace and solitude of
> country life.

We live in Falls Church actually.  We've already seen the Cherry
blossums.

> > > > Chicago has the second highest population of Poles outside
> > > > of Poland.  My father spent more time speaking Polish
> > > > in Scottsdale than he did in the ethnic Polish neighborhood
> > > > he grew up in Pennsylvania.
> > >
> > > Sure, but he also worked with Americans and socialized with them.
> And,
> > > as I suggested earlier, my friend from Kuwait only took a few weeks
> to
> > > don cutoffs and tees.  :-)
> >
> > I don't recall you mentioning this "friend."  Is he as
> > real as your NRA membership card? :-)
>
> It's a SHE.  And she's not here now; she's back in Kuwait.  She's much
> younger than me, and was,  more correctly a friend of my kids, but she
> spent two summers with us, so I consider her a friend as well.
> However, whether or not you wish to believe me is not relevant to the
> point I'm making, that American culture becomes part of the culture of
> people who live here.

I'm sure if she were real, she'd naturally be a lot younger
than you. :-)  (Then again, she'd probably be younger
than me too :-)

> > > > It's kind of funny to hear you talk of assimulation because
> > > > my wife was just asking me to take her to an "American"
> > > > restaurant.  I said there wasn't any, really.  I guess
> > > > could take her to a steak house but she's not a big fan
> > > > of steak.
> > >
> > > I think that's one of the best things about America is that it's
> the
> > > only place where you can eat Italian food served by an African
> waiter,
> > > and cooked by ???????  etc.
> >
> > Indeed.  My wife suggested maybe opening up a Ukrainian
> > restaurant because she said that America lacked DECENT
> > restaurants.
>
> I am Scottish, with one Russian offshoot, from my mother's side of the
> family, and my mother makes Russian food.  Your alleged wife could
> indeed open up a Ukrainian restaurant if there is none where you live.
> Here, if I want good Russian food, there is a street fair every Tues.
> It's very good.

Oh really!  Where is this street fair, exactly?  Is it
as real as your Kuwaiti friend and NRA card?

> > > Indeed.  The first thing my wife observed was "American
> > > > > > women sure are fat, aren't they?" :-)  Such women
> > > > > > really are going to convince these women to
abandon their
> > > > > > values while patronizing them and insulting their
> > > > > > birth cultures.  Yeah, the men really need to
worry! :-)
> > > > >
> >Actually, Mark...Russian brides want to fit right in with their
>  American neighbors.  Women enjoy relationships with other women.

While they wear their Levis made in Russia, yes? :-)

> > My wife certainly has many women friends.  However,
> > she gossips about them all the time with me about how
> > she thinks one of them is snubbing her or about how the other
> > looks down on her, or how she finds the politics of one
> > loathsome.
>
> She may be experiencing some degree of homesickness, for her own girl
> friends at home.  And, women like to talk about personal relationships,
> not necessarily wanting your help, but rather using you as a sounding
> board.
> Besides, finding good friends is similar to love, you have to kiss a
> lot of frogs before meeting the prince. ;-)
>
> > Meow baby!
>
> >?????

It's not too difficult to figure out: I was pointing out
that her friendships were no substitute for actual family.

> > The one constant is that she wants to talk about all
> > of them with me.  I'm not going to worry too much. :-)
>
> Why should you "worry" at all, Mark?  Are you that insecure that, at
> some point, she will see thru you?   After all, having friends is also
> a good way to bounce things off of them, about you.  :-)

Indeed!  I needn't worry.  Thank you for pointing that out. :-)

> > News flash: Sex and the City is a myth.  Women aren't
> > all hugs and kisses with each other.  At least not
> > on the surface.
>
> The idea of women having female friends is certainly NOT a myth, but
> using your alleged wife as an example, may not be particularly
> productive since it takes time to build friendships, and she left those
> behind when she came here, at least on an everyday level.

Ever hear of ICQ chat?  She checks up on them and visits
them when we go back every half year or so.

> I guess they'll need to put on some weight then and
> > > > learn how to dress frumpy. :-)
> > > >
> > > Either that, or the thin Russian woman will encourage the American
> fat
> > > woman to work out more.  But let's face it, Russian women come in
> all
> > > shapes and sizes as well.
> >
> > Yeah, but they aren't "supersized" as much as the
> > liberated American gals. :-)
> >
> > > And Americans are fatter than Europeans per
> > > se, but that includes FAT MEN.
> >
> > Yeah, but we have bones to hang it on.  We don't lose
> > our figure if we throw on an extra 20 lbs.
> >
> Sure you do, Mark.  Fat men are no more attractive than fat women no
> matter how much you try to convince yourself otherwise.

A man with an extra 20 lbs is hardly "fat".

> > I remember a cute conversation I had with an American
> > woman I met through the personals 10 years ago.  She
> > went on and on about what she demanded and asked
> > me how tall I was.  At that point, I had given
> > up so I thought, what the hell, I'll have a little
> > fun: I said 6 feet tall.
> >
> > I asked her how much she weighed.
> >
> > She fidgeted and said that she was "normal" and I asked
> > for a number.  She squeezed out 150lbs.
>
> > I said I didn't think things were going to work out. :-)
> >
> Well, 150 is quite a bit, especially if she's short.  I must admit
> tho...it seems a bit shallow to me to be discussing looks before you
> even meet.  And, it sounds like you're a rather shallow hal...lying to
> her while she was, apparently telling you the truth.  But that's what
> I've come to expect from you, Mark.

Lying isn't shallow.  On the contrary, I didn't care if
she was a bit "chunky".  I was only looking for a way
to expose her shallowness and did so effectively.

> I guess Saudi women will get rights when Saudi men
> > feel like giving them, eh? :-)
>
> Every day, it seems that Saudi women are being more and more vocal and
> perhaps Saudi men are concluding that slaves will never love the
> master.
> In any event, you can't "give" what you don't own.

So go there and feel free to be vocal. :-)

> > > My wife generally prefers the company of other internationals.
>
> She will tend to meet more Americans than "other internationals".

What's neat about a large society is that she can be picky
and still have a pretty large selection of the kind of
people she prefers to be with.

> > I hate to give you a point, but you're right that educated
> > men tend to want to stay in their class if only because
> > of what they have in common.  I wouldn't feel right
> > with a woman who liked to watch wrestling and
> > hang out at bars.
>
> Thank you.  That was my point.

Perhaps.  But it's not a very useful point as seen below:

> > But overall, I don't really think a lot about education
> > in terms of the woman having a degree and high paying job
> > and most men are the same way.  If the woman has something
> > to talk about with them that's in their same interest,
> > that's sufficient.
>
> IOW, you think women should be educated to make conversation with their
> husbands.  Gotcha!  They should be courtesans for their husbands.

If a woman is waiting for a man to ask her out and treat her
for dinner, it would be useful if she actually had something
to offer, yes?

In that regard, educated women are largely no better

--- PCBoard (R) v15.3/M 100