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From: Paul 
Newsgroups: microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
Subject: Re: Cloning a 2.5" IDE/PATA Laptop Hard drive
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2017 15:06:33 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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james@nospam.com wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Nov 2017 06:37:23 -0500, Paul  wrote:
> 
>> How is that possible ?
>>
>> You'd need a pretty new power supply, to not have the floppy connector.
>> Or maybe a very old one.
>>
>> "Molex 4-pin LP4 & Floppy Drive 4-pin SP4 Female Adapter Converter Y Cable"
>>
>> The closest I could find to a classical one, is a Molex that goes
>> to two SP4 connectors.
>>
>> https://www.amazon.com/C2G-Cables-Go-Internal-Multi-Color/dp/B0002J1KW6
>>
>> Normally, you'd buy a Molex that goes to another Molex plus a Floppy SP4.
>> And I'm not seeing any of those for sale.
>>
>> *******
>>
>> This site has pictures of power connectors if you need them.
>> Might take a while to load on your dialup connection.
>>
>> http://www.playtool.com/pages/psuconnectors/connectors.html
>>
>> *******
>>
>> I would check to make sure one of the wire looms isn't all wound
>> up in an elastic and hiding the floppy power connection.
>>
>>    Paul
> 
> You're right. It was well hidden. That computer came with one of those
> mini card readers. For SD, MMC, whatever they are all called....
> I think that thing was put where a floppy drive would go. That thing had
> 4 slots, and was using 4 drive letters, sandwiched in between hard
> drives and CD. That annoyed the shit out of me, so I unplugged it almost
> as soon as I bought the computer. (The only mini cards I use are SD from
> my camera, and I have a USB adaptor for that). 
> 
> Anyhow, the power plug for a floppy drive was crammed above that stupid
> mini card thing. Since I dont plan ot ever use that thing, I may remove
> it and put my floppy drive in that slot.
> 
> By the way, it's been a long time since I installed a floppy drive. The
> cable is straight on one end and has a set of twisted wires on the other
> end. Am I correct that the twisted end goes to the floppy drive? (Or
> will it work either way)?

The twisted end is the floppy end. The twist is presumably for
drive selection, but maybe Wikipedia has a reference on that.

    X------------------X--twist--X
  mobo                           FloppyA

The cable has a red mark indicating pin 1.

The drive casing has a triangle marking pin 1 stamped in the metal.
You need a strong work light, and your wits about you, not to miss
these "hints printed in metal". It was the same thing when I
got my first optical drive to install, I entirely missed the
beautiful legend printed in the metal, which identified
everything.

Some drive cables have the alignment tab, but it's
quite common for installers to get it wrong, and
rotate the cable 180 degrees. If the cable is rotated
on the floppy end, the LED on the floppy will come on,
the heads will stay selected. That's how you know it's
inserted wrong on the floppy end. There is no damage
to the floppy, if it's inserted wrong. I can't say what
happens if you insert cable wrong in FloppyA and right in
FloppyB, whether messing up one of the two connectors
in a dual floppy setup, has as happy a set of symptoms.

The motherboard end, the cable should have a "blocked pin".
Using a flashlight, examine the floppy connector on the
motherboard for a missing pin. The motherboard connector
should have a dot or triangle near the pin 1 end. The
alignment (Blocked) pin should prevent the motherboard
end from being inserted incorrectly. And sometimes the
motherboard end has an alignment tab, which makes it
real easy to figure out.

There are hints. You need a lot of light. The symbols
needed, are in the general area, so keep looking for hints.

But the floppy cable is just about the worst design
in the machine, in terms of keying. As far as I'm concerned
they could have used the alignment tabs that prevent
reversal, on all the connectors.

*******

Just because a machine has one IDE (for two HDD), and
two SATA cables (for two more HDD), doesn't mean you're
limited. There are SATA to IDE and IDE to SATA dongles
of various sorts. I own an IDE to SATA, for my IDE
motherboards, so I can connect a SATA drive to them.
I don't have a SATA to IDE drive one, it's missing
from my collection. I had a great brand picked out
and everything, but no retailer in Canada carried it.
Some of the good ones, went out of production seven
years ago. But, there are still a few for sale today.
There are a number of different designs - some are
even "bidirectional" designs. And it's the usual thing,
some fit the device end, some are designed to be plugged
into the motherboard end.

I was limited to shopping in Canada, by the Customs & Excise
scam the courier companies were carrying out. No company
wants to deal with Postal Mail shipments today. They all want
to use a courier. The courier wants to slap a brokerage
fee onto the shipping, making it uneconomical for small
shipments. Over the years, Canada has not raised the
"small dollar" customs-free feature, and it's possibly
still in the $20 range. If something arrives by Post
for example, with a stated dollar value less than $20,
there's no Customs & Excise stop for that. Canada Post
just delivers that to your door.

When I was a teenager, before Couriers, all the surplus
electronics companies I used to deal with, they shipped
Postal no problem at all. I used to do my own brokerage
at the Customs & Excise building myself. Canada Post would
send the parcel to Customs, a notice card would come in
the mail, I'd head down and deal with a clerk at the
counter. No scams back in those times... Actual honest
dealing. Unheard of.

    Paul
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