John Edser  wrote or quoted:
>  Tim Tyler  wrote:-

> > > JE:- [...]
> > > However, now no way exists to actually measure relatedness! Please 
> > > provide the so far entirely missing
> > > measuring  mechanism for calculating so called shared genes that
> > > is not just an IBD measure so you can _know_ that a negative r means
> > > an "individual shares even fewer genes with you than a
randomly-chosen
> > > member of the population".
> 
> > TT:-
> > http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/links/doi/10.1111/j.1420-9101.200
> > 4.00775.x/full/
> ...has a history of the idea with references.
> 
> JE:-
> The above link only produced an error.

There are some JavaScript errors on the page.

You can usually turn them off to view the content, though.

If it helps, here's the same content as a PDF file:

http://blackwell-synergy.com/links/doi/10.1111/j.1420-9101.2004.00775.x/pdf

> TT:-
> Negative relatedness does have a biological meaning - it indicates
> when "spiteful" behaviour would be favoured by selection.
> See, for example:
> 
> ``Spite: Hamilton?s unproven theory''
> 
>  - http://www.sekj.org/anz/anz3834.htm#229
> 
> JE:-
> Spite:-
> ?an action that harms a recipient at no direct
> benefit to the actor, could evolve if interactants
> were negatively related?.

That's the idea exactly, yes.

If you can't improve the lot of your offspring directly, you
might still be able to benefit them and their genes indirectly -
by sabotaging their prospective competitors.

It's a plan that would be most effective in small populations.

> No THEORY of relatedness can be negative because
> you cannot be BIOLOGICALLY related less than zero.
> Either you are or you are not related, no exceptions.

In this context, relatedness ("r") is defined differently from
the way you are expecting.

Calling it "relatedness" still seems fairly reasonable, though -
since it's usually a close match for Wright's idea of relatedness.
-- 
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