From: rbs{at}snippets.org
To: c_echo{at}yahoogroups.com

On Fri, 1 Aug 2003 Charles Angelich wrote:

> RBS> Charles and I have crossed paths many times over the years.
>
> Yes, I was here when you still collected the SNIPPETS from
> other programmers.

You conveniently forget that I wrote about 35% of the collection. What
I've published is still only the tip of the iceberg - at last reckoning, I
have some 15 additional Mbytes archived awaiting publication. Again, much
of it my own.

> RBS> If you reread some of our exchanges, it quickly becomes
> RBS> obvious that he considers me an arrogant a**hole and I
> RBS> consider him a belligerent fool.
>
> Don't put words in my mouth. I consider you to be just what you are, an
> opportunist - and thanks for the comment about me. It makes it easier to
> disagree with you.

Actually, "belligerent" was the wrong word - I should have simply said
"argumentative".

I feel obliged to point out that I'm hardly only person who's collected
and published free source code. By your definition, the FSF and Linus
Torvald are also opportunists. The main difference between me and them is
that I make sure that the source I publish is *totally* free of any legal
encumbrances - which even includes the Gnu GPL.

Between this statement and the one about my collecting SNIPPETS from other
programmer, you seem to be implying that I have done something somehow
unethical. Since every SNIPPETS author is acknowledged, and since it is a
free collection of free source code, your implicit cynicism lacks
credibility. If I sold the code, or plagiarized it and put my name on
other people's work, I'd deserve your attack. As it is, all you're doing
is exposing your own mean-spirited agenda.

> I wasn't sniping, I was offering what I perceive as good advice. You
> came here apparently dead-ended and I offered suggestions as to how to
> rethink your approach and continue moving forward. You have tunnel
> vision (as usual).

The problem is solved for this client. Rather than generate a large formal
document, we agreed to enforce coding style rules using C-Clearly. All I
then had to do was create the standard template to configure it, and that
part of the job was done with no more effort that what I would have spent
writing a formal document using the Straker book.

> The "belligerent fool" comment certainly does justify my
perceptions of
> you, yes.

Since when did you feel the need of justification for your vitriol?

> No, everyone who was here and got to know you well enough also left this
> echo because of you.

Charles, I served some 3 terms as moderator at a time when the C_Echo had
it's highest membership. I still maintain cordial relationships with many
of the old-timers here. Whatever else I may or may not have done, I have
the satisfaction of having helped teach an entire generation of C
programmers and providing them with a few megabytes of free source code to
crib and learn from. What have you done equally constructive?

> You obviously feel the need to apologize for being an American, I don't.

"Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel." - Samuel Johnson. As with
the lady with the Dixie Chicks, there are certain individual Americans I'd
be ashamed to be compared with - you for example. Still, my wife is from
Michigan so I know there are good people up there.

> With Americans like you we don't really need the French anymore.

OK, were those the words I wasn't supposed to be putting in your mouth?
;-)

> RBS> Actually, I was reporting what the company purchasing lady
> RBS> told me. It turns out that the reason she couldn't buy it
> RBS> from Amazon UK or Amazon Germany is that they were out of
> RBS> stock as well. :-(
>
> I based my replies to you on what you had posted here. If you mislead
> all of us who is to blame for that?

Reading some of the other posts in this thread, you seem to be the only
only who didn't understand and felt in any way "misled". That leads to
only two possible conclusions: 1) you are acting purely out of personal
animosity, or 2) your comprehension level is lower that the other members
of this group. So which is it - are you dumb or simply nasty?

> A three page document that refers to a nonexistent book is a flyer or
> 'infomercial' for the book.

Well it was enough to win ISO-9000 certification for the software
department standards at three divisions of Baker Hughes. Of course, then,
the book was available and I bought one for every programmer in all three
divisions. It was quick, educational, and effective. Small wonder that I
would have preferred to have been able to do the same thing this time.

> RBS> If the book isn't available, [...]
>
> RBS> If the book is available, [...]
>
> YOU came here saying the book wasn't available and now you say it is and
> give me a lecture about how much it will help. I think you are confused
> or just looking for people to annoy.

How can you program if you don't understand the meaning of the word "if"?
If I were simply tying to be annoying, I'd learn from the Michigan master.

> I worked as a PC consultant for 8 years...

Ah, a "PC consultant" - that explains a lot...

> ...and I didn't constantly refer to books the company did not have.

Neither did I. If the book had been available, I would've used it. That's
why I came here asking about it. Since it wasn't, I came up with alternate
plan B which took just as little time - problem solved.

> >> You have a real problem with this don't you.
>
> RBS> Well, someone does, and I don't think it's him.
>
> You removed what I was replying to, it was the second time being
> American was brought into question in the same message by the same
> person. Crawl around apologizing for being American if you think it
> makes you more 'continental' but I think it makes you just what you are,
> an opportunist.

I don't apologize for being an American citizen, but neither do I feel
compelled to wrap myself in a flag to feel superior. Anyway, thanks for
this last outburst - it fully exposes the chauvinism that was noted in the
other message.

Sorry Charles, this message only reinforces my conviction that you are
both "belligerent/argumentative" and a "fool".

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