From: Ellen K. 

No, G-d did not "come about", being above time there is no
"before G-d".

On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 20:36:07 +0000, Adam
<""4thwormcastfromthemolehill\"{at}the field.near the
bridge"> wrote in
message :

>Ellen K. wrote:
>> You are anthropomorphizing G-d... making Him just like a person only
>> more.   While it is a normal human tendency to explain things in human
>> terms, in this case it is wrong.
>>
>
>Rubbish. That is the old "oh but God is so far from your understanding
>that you will just have to accept" bullsh*t that died in the enlightenment.
>
>The ID fallacy depends for it's pseudo-logic upon the central concept
>that something complex (such as an eye or a person) can not just come
>about but must be created/designed etc.
>
>However it appears that central conept is flawed in that it would appear
>that the very same people then go onto declare that something as complex
>etc as God did just come about & was not created/designed.
>
>Adam
>
>> On Thu, 10 Nov 2005 15:39:20 +0000, Adam 
>> wrote in message :
>>
>>
>>>Gary Britt wrote:>>Adam
>>>
>>>
>>>>Gary
>>>>
>>>>"Adam"
<""4thwormcastfromthemolehill\"{at}the field.near the
bridge"> wrote
>>
>> in
>>
>>>>message news:43744185$1{at}w3.nls.net...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Gary Britt wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>God is definitely a he.  That's why he made me a he.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>That would make him an it.
>>>>>
>>>>>Adam
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Gary
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Adam"
 wrote in message
>>>>>>news:43736cf9{at}w3.nls.net...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Geo wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Doesn't your definition of God kind of
require that? I mean unless
>>
>> you
>>
>>>>>>think
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>he got drunk one weekend and barfed up the universe..
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Well...(A) it may be a she & (b) I think
it's the Egyptian version
>>
>> which
>>
>>>>>>>had the chief god type having a wank & all
life & te stars etc are his
>>>>>>>"effusion"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Adam
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>No, God always was.  The beginning and the end.
>>>>
>>>
>>>So your own argument breaks down irretrievably.
>>>
>>>Either something very complex etc requires an ID or it doesn't
& God is
>>>the most complex of all given he is omnipresent & omnipotent.
>>>
>>>Thus it follows that vastly complex things do not require an ID at all
>>>as you are saying that God did not require one.
>>>
>>>Adam
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Gary
>>>>
>>>>"Adam"
<""4thwormcastfromthemolehill\"{at}the field.near the
bridge"> wrote in
>>>>message news:4372f66e$1{at}w3.nls.net...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Geo wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>No, one is a religious argument that starts out
from the assumption that
>>>>
>>>>you
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>know or at least that someone knows, the other is a
quest to understand
>>>>
>>>>what
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>nobody knows.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Also the whole argument falls down on the basis that
the most complex
>>>>>thing of all (i.e. the ID it/him/herself) apparantly did just
>>>>>spontaneously come into being.
>>>>>
>>>>>Adam
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Geo.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Gary Britt"
 wrote in message
>>>>>>news:437270d4{at}w3.nls.net...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Yes it is a religious argument, but so is the
theory of evolution from
>>>>
>>>>the
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>big bang to modern man.  They are both
religions not scientific fact.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Gary
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Tony Williams"
 wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:43726e0e$1{at}w3.nls.net...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>You see the point though. It's always
possible to back up one meta
>>>>
>>>>level
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>and say that's where the Intelligent
Designer put a hand on the wheel.
>>>>>>>>It's a religious argument, not a scientific one.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>>Tony
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Gary Britt wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Not if the unseen hand was smart enough.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Gary
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>"Tony Williams"
 wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>news:43726920$1{at}w3.nls.net...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Gary Britt wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>It might have been an
intelligent hand that created gravity and the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>other
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>laws of the universe.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>%%% COSMOS RUNTIME SYSTEM %%%
>>>>>>>>>>%%% FATAL ERROR %%%
>>>>>>>>>>%%% INFINITE RECURSION DETECTED AT
LINE 6060842 %%%
>>>>>>>>>>%%% STOP %%%
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>>>>Tony
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>

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