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echo: firearms
to: PAUL LEE
from: TONY BELDING
date: 1998-04-05 20:02:00
subject: Future rifles

 PL> You have a lot of info on designs for future rifles, particularly on
 PL> those with electronic ignition and caseless ammo. I am certainly not an
 PL> expert on those issues,
Oh, I'm not an expert either.  I've just picked up a few factoids here and 
there.
 PL> but I do have some questions: 1. How well does
 PL> the caseless ammo withstand field use? Most of the gun powders are
 PL> cellulose based, and when exposed to chemicals such as acetone,
 PL> gasoline, benzene, etc., cellulose tends to dissolve. 2. Also, if I drop
 PL> or step on an ammo box by mistake, do I get broken ammo that will not
 PL> fit in a rifle anymore ?
Voere claim their ammo is highly durable.  I haven't examined any myself, but 
I've been told the propellant looks and feels like hard, white plastic. I 
also read where somebody stuck a G11 round in his pants pocket for about a 
week, along with keys and change, and it wasn't harmed any significant way.
 PL> 3. If the mfg hardens the outer layer of the
 PL> caseless ammo with some sort of coating, how well will that coating
 PL> burns off during ignition, and how much residue will it leave behind?
I haven't heard about any coating.
You might have heard about the early caseless ammo experiments of the 1960s, 
where the propellant was basically nitrocellulose powder compressed into a 
sort of cake.  The new propellants have progressed way beyond that.  They are 
solid material.
 PL> 4. Now that the brass case is gone, I imagine that the primer will also
 PL> have to be changed, ie, no more metallic cup. But there must be some
 PL> hard surface for the primer to initiate ignition. WHat are those hard
 PL> surfaces made of ?
Sorry, I don't know.  The propellant base itself is hard, so that's probably 
all it takes.  The Voere ammo uses an electrical ignitor, so a hard surface 
as such is not needed anyhow.
 PL> 5. If electronic ignition is used, how long does the battery last?
 PL> ALso, being small and therefore hard to handle in the field, how can a
 PL> soldier replace a battery under fire?
Keep in mind, no military rifle has been announced with electronic ignition. 
Voere presumably had plans for something like that, but nothing came of it. 
Instead they wound up selling bolt-actions sporting rifles.  IF I recall 
correctly, it only needed a small coin-type battery, and it was good for 
several thousand shots.
Some other things...  Voere claimed their ignition would only fire with an 
electrical pulse of exactly the right voltage and other characteristics, so 
it couldn't go off accidentally from static electricity or whatever.
From what I hear, the biggest technical problem H&K ran into with their 
caseless ammo was heat buildup in the chamber.  They found in a conventional 
rifle, a lot of heat is carried out of the chamber by the brass case.  When 
the G11 was fired rapidly, the chamber temperature increased until the rounds 
started "cooking off".
In some respects, I think caseless ammo might be more successful for civilian 
use than for the military.  The "cookoff" effect wouldn't be a problem in 
sporting rifles.  Produced in quantity, caseless ammo would be cheaper to 
make than conventional ammo -- an important concern when Uncle Sam isn't 
picking up the tab for it.  Getting caught with a dead battery (using the 
Voere system) wouldn't be a life-or-death matter.  Also, caseless ammo 
wouldn't litter up the environment with discarded brass.
 Tony Belding 
 http://hamilton.htcomp.net/tbelding/
--- Spot 1.3a #535
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* Origin: The Land Beyond (1:273/952.2)

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