-> The next verse is 1Tim 2:4 that says "God would have all men to be sa
-> and come to the knowledge of the truth". Now this really puts the nai
-> in the coffin of Calvinism some say. Well does it? Lets start with
-> verse 1. We are exhorted to pray for "all men". Now since this epistl
-> was written for the purpose of how we are to conduct ourselves in the
-> local assembly chapter 3:15 we see that this exhortation for us to pr
-> for all men in our local assembly. I wonder how many churches pray fo
-> every person of the human race each Lord's day. Does yours?  Now look
-> at these 1st 2 verses all that I know agree that this all means-
-> NOT ALL MEN WITHOUT EXCEPTION BUT ALL MEN ***WITHOUT DISTINCTION!***
->
Mick, by adding your own words "all men in our local assembly" will not
change the scriptures.  Why would you even want to do that?
The all men to be saved is a prayer of the highest calling in Christ.
He as saviour and intercessor on behalf of sick men is evident in His
life and gospel.  If you add the words in the Assembly, it then implies
that not everyone in your church is even saved.  That would be an
indictment that there is not enough Holy Ghost conviction to convict a
person of their sins and a very dangerous precedent for the Church of
Jesus Christ.  The prayer for all men is a good prayer in that it is
beneficial  from a good motive, a loving interest in the world around
us, and it promotes our neighbors highest welfare.....
It is dangerous to add words to the word of God to achieve ones goals
in belief system, and one might say that means every time you read that
scripture you see it through a lense that protects your doctrine rather
than seeking for truth....
-> Well then why does it change in verse 4? Paul is on the same thought.
-> verse 3 he says that this praying for all kinds of men even wicked
-> kings, (remember Nero was king when he wrote this), as well as the po
-> peasent, this is"good and acceptable in the sight of God". Why?!!!!
->
I don't see any change in verse 4 Mick.  None is even implied.  The
Jewish writer uses the form of prose, that is noticeably Jewish in that
he again reiterates the premise in verse 1, and then adds a distinctive
as to what the conclusion should be.  Since i already wrote above as to
the whys of prayers and intercessions for the world we live in, i won't
attempt to address this again.
-> Because would have all men without distinction be saved. Now if you
-> still do not agree look at  verse 6. He gave himself a ransom for all
-> right????
->
-> Well what does the next phrase say? "to be testified in due time" or
-> more literally "the testimony in their own times". What this says tha
-> fact He was a ransom for all will eventually be shown to be true. Wel
-> if it all men without distinction then that makes sense as we see all
-> types coming into the kingdom. But....if it is all men without except
-> then you absolutely have to believe all men will be saved!
Nope not at all.  God's offer is to all, He knows who will accept and
who will reject but his hand is still outstretched.  Since i already
addressed the facts surrounding as to how many and who would be saved i
won't repeat myself here.
--- WILDMAIL!/WC v4.12 
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