On Sat, 27 Mar 2021 10:30:07 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
 wrote:

>On 27/03/2021 05:17, 6+Cola wrote:
>>   I am not religious. If we are to be "preserved" we will have
>>    to do it ourselves.
>>
>>    And NOBODY "has the answers" because humans are an
>>    erratic, illogical, congnitive-dissonance-loving species. There
>>    are eight billion notions about how things should be -  and a
>>    new eight billion tomorrow. Human societies are a sort of
>>    perpetual kludge, BARELY working, but there's no other way.
>
>People misquote the corollary of Darwin's evolutionary notion. It is
>less the survival of the fittest than the elimination of the bottom
>useless one percent.

  What' s "useless" today may become vital tomorrow. Any
  change in the "environment" can drastically change the
  Darwinian equation.

> From Nature's perspective, nothing matters except that the species
>stumbles through childhood and puberty, and makes it into the bushes for
>the crudest form of sex imaginable.

  So far as straight Darwin goes. However humans have a lot
  more IQ than ferrets and beetles. Mere rapid reproduction
  does not necessarily guarentee Darwinian "fitness".

  There IS a form of "social Darwinism", though most people
  get it very wrong - the "fittest" is always the very image of
  the particular cultures elite when what survives is often
  something quite different.


>>    Weirdly, even ancient societies with NO grasp of how the
>>    universe worked STILL tended to persist, indeed often
>>    became successful. That means something, but I'm not
>>    sure what. Is a good collective lie more important than
>>    The Truth ???
>
>Very much so. Given that the above criteria are all that matters, a big
>all powerful sky fairy with awesome powers who wrote a book of moral
>behaviour oddly suited to the cohesion of large societies in an emerging
>agrarian age, was bound to get to be wise rulers' favourite state religion.

  Perhaps there are a dozen things you have to get just right, and
  the other 99% of "truths" can be pure garbage. Doesn't matter
  if you worship the Tree Spirits or a big black rock, doesn't
  matter if you think the world is flat or that demons lurk in
  every shadow. Empires did just fine believing Aristotles
  somewhat defective physics.

  However TOO big a burden of false truths MAY limit a societies
  ultimate growth and success - trap them at a certain level. Had
  the HRCC managed to crush the New Science, where would
  we be now ? Likely alive, perhaps even "doing well", but "well"
  would involve a lot of treading manure into our stick-farming
  plots, not going to the moon or buying Raspberry Pi's. China's
  Confucius  and Taoism instilled a certain ultra-conservatism
  that, while the society survived, thwarted the persuit of
  scientific knowledge and the changes needed to adapt to
  such knowledge. Mao rather ruthlessly beat that out of them ...


>That it has collapsed in a post industrial one, is not surprising.
>
>Your comments on 'political math' too are cogent: in an age of universal
>franchise and the equivalence of voters, to leave actual rulership to
>the whim of '?? ??????' is simply unthinkable for any emergent oligarchy.
>
>The natural tendency of such an oligarchy is to control all aspects of
>public communication that it can, to first of all suppress any idea that
>  the system that allows them to exist at all, needs modification.
>
>Instead the invention of a Punch and Judy show, where you are restricted
>to voting for Punch (Donald Trump) or Judy (Hilary Clinton) and every
>utterance is backed up by cynical market research to see which
>particular utterance has public traction, so that they can build an
>emotional and political narrative of 'nationalism,' or 'liberalism' to
>disguise what is really going on - the usurpation of all powers by the
>oligarchy itself, not for the purposes of governing the nation, but to
>preserve the current ruling oligarchy. And pay off the very few members
>of society it actually needs - and as I pointed out, with mechanisation,
>only the technocrats are useful.
>
>Liberalism is an adapted Marxist creed that appeals to the educated
>technocratic middle class, as it panders to their fondness for feeling
>intellectually superior and their emotional emptiness resulting from a
>lack of religion. So Moral Causes have great political traction.
>
>Which is why it has abandoned the blue collar worker to the dustbin of
>history and is engaged in destroying all opposition to what was once
>known colloquially as 'the Man' ..
>
>It doesn't matter who you vote for, the Government always wins...because
>they are the ones with their fingers up the bottoms of Punch, as well as
>Judy.
>
>Without an external existential crisis like the Cold war or WWII there
>is nothing for Government to do. Except feather its nest and ensure its
>own existence.
>
>Darwin rules, even in an oligarchy.
>
>The internet must be controlled for 'all the right reason' - can't have
>people talking about anything other than the faux issues of social
>justice, climate change, and gender politics - that are used to create
>an *impression* of lively democratic debate by 'informed' people on
>'serious issues'.
>
>British parliament spent ten times as much time debating the morality of
>fox hunting, than it did debating on whether or not to enter the Iraq
>war, based on forged documentation.
>
>Go figure.

  There were perhaps greater gains involved in Iraq, if not for
  the politicians then their patrons. There is money and influence
  for those who involve themselves in major world events, which
  will lead to more money and influence. Hardly matters if the
  cause is just, or even real. Only players profit.

  The fox hunting, well, that's an attractive distraction to keep
  the common minds focused on the wrong things.

  STILL a fine tutor after all this time, Machiavelli. Delve beyond
  "Prince". His "Discourses" are even more educational - not
  just the "what", but the "why".

  Why do horrifically-incompetent CEOs and politicians get
  a "golden parachute" ? Machiavelli explains ... and it's logical

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